- cross-posted to:
- noncrediblediplomacy@sh.itjust.works
- politicalmemes@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- noncrediblediplomacy@sh.itjust.works
- politicalmemes@lemmy.world
SOUTH AMERICAN ELECTIONS
[two different people are being portrayed side by side]
Gabriela Rosa Sympatica
Elementary school teacher
Beloved by her community
Wants to improve lives
[portrait of a smiling woman in overalls]
Diego Hitlerio de la Junta
Son of a previous dictator
Went to jail for corruption
Wants to sterilize natives
[portrait of a frowning nasty looking character in military gear]
Temporary results (98% ballots counted):
[Gabriela] 49.9999%
[Diego] 50.0001%
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This meme forgot to mention that the hitler candidate probably has a million dollar campaign funded by US billionaires or even the United States government itself and that he promised that when he won he would build 2 military bases in his territory, give up all hos country’s resources and infrastructure to US companies and a lot of land to zionist settlers.
At least we’re honest about it. Donald Trump stole an election in a way that looks better on the news and the USAmericans refuse to believe that it wasn’t legitimate. Death to the USA
These are getting progressively less bad.
Shit like that makes me think Americans aren’t that different than they’re “third world” counter parts
In the US version the left side candidade would be “Identitaria Fatcatus-Loving”, listed as:
- Got several million dollar plus campaign contributions
- Upper middle-class, never met a single poor person in her life and yet looks down on them
- Says one thing, does something else
- Doesn’t talk about Wealth Inequality, EVER.
- Is <list of identitarian “specificities”>
At least the “third”-world places often have electable left of center candidates, not just Fascist vs Warmongering Hardcore Neoliberal.
It’s something expected to happen in first past the post electoral systems. It’s by design things like these happen
Power Duopolies are better than Power Monopolies but not by much and they certainly do not represent the true breadth of political beliefs of a population of millions of people.
In countries with such systems (at least in the ones I lived in) people get trained by the Press to expect everything boils down to “one side versus a the other side”, but if you actually analyse the whole thing and think about even simple choices in groups of people (say, “we’re should we go to next?” when out with friends) and it’s very rare that even for just one thing there are only 2 prefered choices in a group with more than 2 people, so now imagine how many possibilities there are in all combinations of preferences for all the social and political choices in a country of millions.
Representative Democracy by necessity is a heavilly reduced and simplified reflection of the preferences in the society they mean to represent and those variants of it where the representation system is Mathematically Rigged to de facto reduce that representation to just two, is literally the second farthest political system from properly representing a population, with the farthest one being dictatorship.
Personally I don’t count Power Duopolies like that real Democracies: a vote alone doesn’t make something a Democracy, otherwise Russia would be a Democracy.
Yeah first pass the post system does fucky things, but the issue is the dictator being viable and shows that there’s population of that country that supports their violence and oppression…
It’s like watching trump win the 2024 primaries and realizing maga is still core to the Republican party
The affinity towards dictators could be partially explained by this
And because of FPTPs ability to drown voices that are not popular, these dictatorial leaders tend to rise at the top, and only option becomes the other party. The equilibrium of FPTP is a two party system, exactly like the one we see in America.
Unfortunately Trump is a product of this exact machinery.
I say it’s more complicated in that these dictators control mass media and hence why the “vote dictator” germ is everywhere and sustained.
Back in 2016 people were saying that trump is a product of decades of propaganda. Like decades of propaganda got us to trump
In my opinion, the control of mass media is a problem that comes after you elect a dictator. Like we’re talking orban and netanyahu here. Trump did not have Media control until 2016. While arguably he did have some in 2024, his media control wasn’t this strong at any point in history.
Media control is the reason why getting rid of dictators is extremely hard. What I am talking about is what even gets them into the office in the first place
They’re the ones that made the Americas like that.
Yeah but they fall for propaganda all the same. I find hilarious and also an obligation to do counter propaganda
uh did you miss the part where ‘south america’ isn’t a country and that these people don’t exist?
I’m America so I mean usa. I didn’t think south Americans thought of themselves as south Americans. I south America was just a name English speakers made up
Wait they don’t? I think of myself as North American.
I don’t, but idk what other people view themselves
Sympatica is clearly a radical communist while hitlerio is a gentleman, let’s see what he has to say for the next 24 hours of television
Hey, Latin American here! A few comments to expand:
- In the vast majority of Latin American countries, voting is direct. in other words, a vote for a dude is a vote for that dude, period. No electoral colleges or any of that nonsense they do in the United States (Your system is shit, I’ll die on this hill).
- Most elections have a turnout that, in the very best of cases, reaches 50% of the eligible population (those over 18, registered in the system, etc.)
- Therefore, this 50/50 in “real numbers” would be more like 25/25 or so.
- The remaining population would consist of people who are disillusioned with the system or apathetic toward it (mostly young people).
The thing is, no matter how much of an anarchist I want to be, I can’t fully support not voting. Because it’s precisely by not voting that the Diego Hitlerios come to power and screw us all over.
The thing is, no matter how much of an anarchist I want to be, I can’t fully support not voting. Because it’s precisely by not voting that the Diego Hitlerios come to power and screw us all over.
I’m also an Anarchist. I hate how the left has to shoot itself in the foot for the sake of purity constantly. Not voting doesn’t make you more of an Anarchist, or whatever you are. It just makes it so you don’t get a say in the election, and the right certainly doesn’t have any of the same issues with voting. You should vote for whatever moves us toward the correct path, not avoid voting because you think you’re too good for it.
Yes, elections suck. If they worked as well as we want we probably wouldn’t have them (or we’d be in a very different situation and this wouldn’t be an issue). However, participation takes almost no effort. The effect it has per unit of effort spent is pretty incredibly high. It’s not going to change the world, but it will help some people, and it only takes you all of a few minutes usually.
To not try to at least prevent the worst outcome from happening and to not try to make the situation better at least somewhat is just stupid. Although I see myself as an anarchist I vote in every election. There is always a not so shit option on the ballot.
Just voting is still not enough and real change will most certainly not come through a election.(Your system is shit, I’ll die on this hill).
Oh trust me, a lot of us fully agree this system is dumb as hell. Personally I’m in favor of a parliamentary system with a PM who is just a random rep from the leading party and disposing of the senate because it just artificially inflates the voting power of corn. Corn’s cool and all, but I don’t think corn’s existence should count as like 6 Californian votes.
Because of the First Past The Post, even a Parliamentary system in the US with the current Mathematics of how Congress or the Senate representatives are allocated from votes (i.e. single winner per electoral circle) would be still be a two party system which doesn’t represent most people.
Just look at Britain (which has a FPTP Parliamentary System) were the current party in Government has more than 50% of members of Parliament even though they got only 34% of votes and is arresting people as Terrorist Supporters for demonstrating against Britain’s support for the Genocide in Gaza, has enacted quite extreme anti-Demonstration legislation and is passing electronic communications surveillance laws similar to those in Despotic Autocracies.
Absolutelly, Presidential systems where ONE PERSON ONLY supposedly manages the nation according to the will of millions are complete total bullshit because it’s impossible that one person can reflect the preferences of millions, but Parliamentary systems with First Past The Post aren’t much better because de facto they’re generally equivalent to 2 sets of views rather than just 1 - theoretically multiple parliamentarians from the same party would mean multiple view, but my experience living in several such countries is that it’s rare for a member of parliament not to vote the same as the rest of the party in a vote - I would estimate that dissent is in average less than 5%.
Oh, I hate FPtP too, much more of a ranked choice kinda guy. This was just me complaining about my stupid government’s form.
I like Scotland’s proportional representation system. It retains constituency candidates, but compensates non-winning parties with seats based on regional votes. Afaik Wales and Northern Ireland also have proportional systems in their devolved parliaments, so only England is lagging behind :P
the electoral college and a federal government made up of the states rather than of the people along with simple plurality voting sometimes and majority voting others are, mathematically, the least power you can give people while still issuing a ballot. a binary party system is just a unitary party system where the final votes for the party leadership is more visible.
“The people only have those rights which i allow them to have” — Dr DOOM
I like to use a common quote from data archivists: Two is one and one is none.
The more people your system represents the better. Two party systems are an illusion of choice and single party system offer you no choice.
You need a system like Ranked Choice voting to prevent the issues that cause strategic voting and the 2 party system.
What is “Ranked Choice voting”?
Short (mostly correct) answer is instead of picking one candidate, you rank all of them, then when your first choice loses your vote goes to your second choice.
Lets you vote honestly without worrying about who’s most likely to win and gives less common options a chance
this honestly sounds awesome
The UK had a referendum on whether to adopt it and voted against. You ahould have seen the insane rubbish the “no” campaign said about it
We can have nice things once we pass this math test.
https://www.reuters.com/graphics/USA-ELECTION/RANKED-CHOICE/zdpxqrolgvx/
I like that this explanation has pictures
Me watching the peruvian ultraleftist who proudly showed a pic proving he voted for “Tung Tung Lenin” last week, not realizing he might end up being the reason his family and him will get disappeared in a fujimorist labor camp in a few months.
I read “fujimotorist” for a second and it triggered my trauma from the chainsaw man fandom
Nah, not camps. Sterilized and/or “disappeared”, latinamerican way
The electoral college is one of those many US things that kinda made sense 150 years ago.
…And that we never really fixed. Cause we take everything for granted.
Whoops.
it only “made sense” then to preserve the power of the elite pseudo-aristocracy, which is the same thing it does now too (despite the other changes that have been made)
Almost makes you think of the recent US presidential election, where in swing states ONLY and for in-person voting ONLY (not mail-ins), statistically anomalous numbers of Trump ballots were Democrat all the rest of the way down, in numbers just high enough for him to win but just low enough not to trigger mandatory recounts, in places where voting machines received software updates just before and just after the election.
i remember this theory - there were a few issues, if i remember right:
the most obvious being there isn’t actually a way to know how many people vote red or blue down-ballot (for the very obvious reason that nobody knows how specific people’s ballots look) so the guy was making some wild assumptions,
which isn’t shocking considering this same guy had run to the news crying wolf about a previous election (which it isn’t as popular to be conspiritorial about) with similarly massaged logic,
and the very short list of districts which “inexplicably” voted as a block against democrats, if you literally just look at the election history, usually vote as a block and sometimes for republicans - claims it was statistically impossible or whatever really don’t hold up to basic scrutiny,
genuinely i get it, it would be really comforting (in a way) to explain away trump getting elected again as the result of clandestine actors literally flipping bits or whatever, but they didn’t appear to have done that so please stop credulously believing things like this without taking a few minutes to look into it and check if it actually holds water.
the dnc annointed deeply unpopular biden to run again and let him make a fool of himself long after it was clear he wasn’t up to it and didn’t have popular support, replaced him with his vp who wasn’t willing to distinguish herself from him on policy and who sought republican votes at the cost of building enthusiastic support from the whole big tent of democrats, literally refused to even record feedback they received specifically about voters being fed up with the genocide of palestinians when canvassing and conducting surveys, etc. and on the republican side they have engaged in very loud very public voter suppression increasingly for a long time - we don’t need to look for hidden (especially trivially disprovable) insight into what happened when there were such obvious reasons
Dunno which guy you mean but he wasn’t anybody who cried wolf in a previous election. The facts he presented were exactly what I stated - statististically anomalous number of people voting for Trump and then voting for Democrats all the way down the ballot. That happens, but in several of the swing states it happened far more than it ever has, and yet just short of enough to trigger automatic recounts, and only with election-night voting. What you’re responding with is opinion and calling those observations “wild assumptions” without saying what’s wild about them, then some subjective opinion about Biden and genocide yada yada - pure opinion that I’m not here to argue about. The numbers are what they are.
Link please
Sorry, I can’t remember the name of the sattistician who pointed this out last year, just opinion polls now.
Skill issue
There was a site that summarized everything too, can’t remember the name…
Diego Hitlerio said he would open up the nation’s natural resources to American corporations so the CIA is running a smear campaign on Ms. Sympatica and will overthrow her if she still manages to get elected.
So unrealistic, the dictator would win by a way bigger margin. I’m from the Caribbean so I should know.
its usually 97% fuck if I know why
rookie numbers, Putin got way over 100% in some districts
Do you use torrents? Because if so, gasp! Found a real one!
I’ve been torrenting stuff since 20 years ago, LOL.
Cool. Stay safe and watch out for ninjas.
Somehow still doing a better job than the largest country in NA
I feel the comments are referring to the USA, but Canada is the largest could try in North America.
“Could try?” Anyway, true, Canada has 1.6% more land mass than USA.
Not really, latin america is pretty fucked up man. It’s a large part because of that largest country, but no, latin america is by and large a shit show. Even moreso than the US, for the moment, give it some time the US is falling fast.
it’s not latin america’s fault latin america is a mess. latin america was much more stable before european colonization destroyed the social structures and societal infrastructure that had developed there for milenia. the fact we even call it “latin” “america” when those are both european constructs from the peninsula of italy should tell you something
The causes of it being a mess are varied sure. And as I said, due to the US, but also the espaniards before them obviously, mostly from them. They were the fucking devil. There is a reason FARC was started by renegade Jesuit Priests like Sertorius in actual spain from the roman era circa 1st century bc of colonizing spain.
Sertorius was a roman general that got disgusted by the tactics of the empire, and went over to the spanish tribes. He laid waste tot he romans for a long time, it’s a great story, eventually his lieutenant killed him to take the leader post, and promptly lost to pompey that had been dispatched to deal with the rebellion. A decades long rebellion.
I digress though, the pre columbian latin america, had it’s own problems, human sacrifice and such. Cutting people’s hearts out while alive, skinning them alive. That is not all fabrication by the espaniards either I’ve been assured. They were stone age, and doing the same things the old world did in the stone age.
But now, what to do? We need to organize and cooperate on what we agree on. Then [redacted] and to buy that new mario brothers game and learn to play it multiplayer, but once again, I’m off subject.
One backed by propaganda & propped up by the CIA, and one who worked through their community.
one who worked through their community.
Which miraculously didn’t die by CIA hands
That only happens if there’s a chance of them winning, silly
Makes me think of Tropico (I was the Diego Hitlerio)
Tropico 7 gets released this year. I wonder if they’ll have weird interactions with the US, and have an orange president you have to deal with in the modern age or something
They already added presidential tweets to Tropico 6.
Honestly, all I want are more options to make the city look nice
Peru, right? Is really infuring the half of a country decide the destiny of the other half, it show the dead of democratic electoral systems
It’s not just Peru, this dynamic is across Latin America.
As a Brazilian, can confirm, fucking idiots elected Bolsonaro back in 2018 and nearly reelected him in 2022, which led to a coup attempt in Jan 8, 2023. Bozo is being judged, but one of his sons might run for president this year and, despite a very obvious case of “asking for money from a corrupt friend”, he’s still the leading right-wing candidate. Of course, Brazil being Brazil, there are 3 other right-wing candidates that are exactly the same in nearly everything to bozo, but under a different name.
I’d be more cautious of any politician who made it that high while preaching morality in politics than the guy the media presents as evil.
