Explanations I’ve seen:

  • to drive up oil / gas prices (the problem is that the prices are too high, which accelerates the global green energy revolution and the end of the fossil fuel industry while destabilizing western “society”; successfully seizing Iran’s oil would have presumably lowered prices too);

  • Trump’s ego, bolstered by Maduro’s kidnapping and the seemingly successful counter-revolution in Venezuela; the imperial ruling class thought they were invincible because they haven’t suffered a really palpable defeat since Vietnam (I guess Afghanistan / Yemen doesn’t count…);

  • to protect the Zionist entity and the Gulf Monarchies and also to shore up American influence in the region;

  • to slow China’s rise (Iran supplies lots of China’s fossil fuels);

  • a distraction from the Epstein files;

  • lots of powerful ghouls have been itching to do this since 1979;

  • to stop Iran’s nonexistent nuclear weapons program;

  • to game the stock market.

Did I miss anything? What are the most plausible / implausible explanations? Are they all valid? I’m not sure, I’m asking because I want comments / critiques. Also, are we headed to a permanent nationwide blackout in the USA (as predicted by The Simpsons) and the Mad Max-ification of all but the top 10% or will things “go back to normal”? Or will this just become another Ukraine War?

Bonus Q: how are the libs and chuds you know reacting to the war? My spouse thinks that Iran is currently winning but the USA will eventually prevail 🥴

  • curmudgeonthefrog [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    6 days ago

    Ben Norton brings up in one of his recent videos that one of the big reasons for the war is America’s absolute necessity for the dollar to be the global reserve currency, and in this case the petrodollar. Our trade deficit is so much higher than most countries that we would normally have mass inflation if it weren’t for the fact that the world is required to trade in dollars. Iran and Russia have been trading oil in Yuan, currently 1/5th of all global oil is traded without US dollars. That figure is rising every year. If it reaches a point where the majority of oil isn’t traded with dollars. America loses their dollar hegemony. Brings the whole American banking system crashing down (which is the apocalypse for American ruling class). So long story short they need to destroy Iran, control the strait of Hormuz and control all of the oil trading out of the middle east. Otherwise letting things just continue to function as they are will cause America to collapse.

    • LaughingLion [any, any]@hexbear.net
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      This is a good explanation and I think there are probably some ghouls at the top who think this and want this for that reason. However, I don’t think we should overestimate the people in power in their calculations. Usually it’s much simpler and they’ll do this kind of shit just because they huff their own farts and believe their own propaganda. “Iran Bad” is as good enough reason as any for these people as “we’ll just take their oil.” While it’s important to analyze this stuff like that and not to infantilize our ops sometimes it just do be like that.

      • curmudgeonthefrog [he/him]@hexbear.net
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        6 days ago

        For sure, the dumbasses in our hollowed out state department aren’t as machiavellian as they once were. They are still financed and backed by people that look at it through an economic lens. Trump and hegseth can believe whatever they want but the American capitalists backing them are going to push for war to maintain their power.

  • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
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    6 days ago

    The Zionist settler project is dying. New settlers aren’t moving there anymore and the settlers are trying to leave. This is an attempt to resuscitate the settler project, because they think that Iran is the source of all resistance and removing them from the board will solve all the contradictions for the project.

  • Carl [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    6 days ago

    Trump’s people genuinely believe their own bullshit, that all they needed to do was be “unwoke” and that they would crack the nut of winning a war in the middle east. As if George W lost in Iraq and Afghanistan because he was too busy doing land acknowledgements or something.

  • companero [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    6 days ago

    Securing major trade routes in preparation for an effective blockade of China. They want unilateral control of the Strait of Hormuz in order to specifically ban China from using it. It goes beyond Iran’s own energy supplies, because the other Gulf countries supply much more to China than Iran does.

    It’s also why there is a focus on the Panama Canal, Greenland, Israel’s “Somaliland” base, etc.

  • OgdenTO [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    6 days ago

    I think adding to “to slow China’s rise”, to go beyond just fossil fuels, Iran is a key strategic position for China’s Belt and Road Initiative, enabling direct on-land geographical access to Europe and Russia, as well as a key maritime shipping route, according to their plan.

    I think to some extent, this is a desperate ploy to destabilize Iran and delay BRI

  • freagle@lemmy.ml
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    In my view, there are 3 overarching options that are abstract and then we have to get more granular.

    High level option 1: This was the optimal strategic move for the US based on the state of play.

    High level option 2: This was incorrectly believed to be the optimal strategic move for the US based on faulty or incomplete intelligence and analysis.

    High level option 3: This was correctly believed to be a suboptimal (or worse) strategic move for the US but the military is unable to prevent itself from throwing the game.

    If it’s 1, we have a lot of thinking to do. Maybe it was a “now or never” sort of thing. Maybe there’s value in destroying the world’s energy economy. Maybe there’s a wunderwaffe on the way. Maybe they needed to neutralize Iran before they went after China.

    If it’s 2, we have a lot of thinking to do. What would it mean for the US to lose ground here? How will they respond? What opportunities does it open for other adversaries and will they take it? Where did the faulty intelligence come from? Is the intelligence community blinded by ideology and incompetence or were the counter-intelligence capabilities of the axis of resistance that much better?

    If it’s 3, we have a lot of thinking to do. Is POTUS and SecDef actually running the show from a position of ideological blindness? Did they purge enough top brass that the system is incapable of self-correction? Are we at the stage where everyone is lying to the chain of command to keep their jobs, and thus top brass, through their own ideological blindness, have created a death spiral for their own situational awareness?

    In any case, it’s not the Epstein Files.

    If it was optimal, then the US thinks this hurts China or they think it makes their own position stronger for a hot conflict with China. That could mean they have to protect Israel at all cost and it was now or never, or it could mean that Iran would join in China’s defense with full capability and the US needs to degrade Iran’s capabilities on a schedule before the US attacks China, thus reducing the threat Iran poses in that scenario. Perhaps US/Israeli intelligence is deeply infiltrated into Iranian operations and it’s only a matter of time before the US fully disables Iranian power and turns the place into a protracted civil war.

    If it was suboptimal, perhaps Israel is going rogue and feeding bad intel to the US so that they can expand their territory, not realizing Iran was as strong as they are. Perhaps Israeli intelligence is subverting Israeli leadership deliberately. Perhaps Israeli intelligence has been fooled or compromised by resistance counter-intelligence and made to believe Iran was far weaker than it was. Perhaps US intelligence was fooled directly.

    If the military can’t control leadership from taking actions that are known to be deleterious to US strategy, then perhaps it means that Trump personally fired everyone that could stop him. Perhaps Trump’s team is composed of sufficiently effective people that they soft-couped the country. Perhaps the military leadership was always mostly eschatological and just a few key purges were all that was needed to establish a leadership that would knowingly order the US’s own destruction if it aligned with their vision of holy righteousness.

    There’s a lot of known unknowns. There’s a probably a bunch of unknown unknowns.

    Don’t try to be precise and accurate. Just try to be accurate and allow your understanding to have a broad enough scope to be flexible as more evidence emerges. This is a situation to navigate dynamically, not to pin down and examine surgically.

    • PorkrollPosadist [he/him, they/them]@hexbear.netM
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      6 days ago

      If it’s 1, we have a lot of thinking to do. Maybe it was a “now or never” sort of thing. Maybe there’s value in destroying the world’s energy economy. Maybe there’s a wunderwaffe on the way. Maybe they needed to neutralize Iran before they went after China.

      The “now or never” thing is true in the broader sense, whether or not it was the driving factor in starting this war. As China has driven forward in the course of development, the era of US global hegemony is existentially threatened. The United States cannot compete with an industrialized country with four times the population. Put simply, that’s four times the labor, four times the research, four times the machinery, four times the economy, four times the culture. It is a childish analogy, but the best way to describe the US’s position is in the late-game of a round of Sid Meyer’s Civilization, where your neighbor is less than 10 turns away from a science / culture victory and the only option left to delay your loss is the use of nuclear weapons.

      The US has been trying to grapple with this reality for at least a decade now, in various manifestations. From the Yglesias galaxy-brain take that we need “One Billion Americans,” to the military-industrial complex think tanks churning out papers that if we fail to contain China’s development now, it will be impossible in the future. In fact, I believe this is one of the biggest unspoken factors in the AI race. Knowing that it is impossible to out-compete China in terms of human labor and academic research, the ruling class hoped to fill the one billion person gap in intellectual and economic capacity using computers.

      Surely this isn’t the only reason for attacking Iran, but the broader situation only presented two outcomes. Accept China as a peer, or even more capable counterpart in the world system, or destroy it before it is too late. To the western ruling class, the first option is completely unacceptable, so something along these lines was inevitable.

  • GnomeGodsGnomeMasters [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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    6 days ago

    Now, I’m not the most in-the-know person in terms of geopolitics so my take is like 50% vibes-based, but honestly, I think it’s equally likely that it’s also a mix of Kushnerd and Litcough’s incompetence and conflict of interests and Isn’treal’s leveraging of that incompetence and conflict of interest against Drumpf’s need to be perceived as strong and mighty and the rest of the administration’s mix of Zionism, christofascism, and bloodlust (long sentence is long).

    My weird hope is that this is actually some sick underwater 5D long-game chess move engineered by BRICS & Co. to further destabilize NATO and the U.S., ultimately bringing an end to western imperialism and amerikkkan hegemony.

  • MrPiss [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    We need to remember there are multiple competing viewpoints and factions so a lot of contradictory views can be valid at the same time. Different people with different motives were whispering into the mad kings ear at different times.

    Anyway adding onto the oil point, the US does just want control of all global oil to support the petrodollar. Easy to forget but Trump probably did actually think this would be over quick. Since this isn’t a short war it then leads into the higher prices for American oil and gas.

    Some bloodthirsty fascists probably also considered that this would be a controlled demolition of the global economy on the US’s terms. A global crisis to destroy capital stocks and boost profitability for American firms that have access to energy.

  • Hohsia [any]@hexbear.net
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    6 days ago

    Same pillaging as usual, and the overall ignorance is driving me mad. Like I often hear fuck faces at work talking about this like it’s a war that we need to be engaged in or some shit. I am seriously at a point where I wouldn’t mind seeing this country fucking crumble and the American project failing once and for all. And I wouldn’t be surprised if I get my wish because I truly don’t believe this country is competent enough to stop Trump from using nukes

    If you consider yourself a serious person and talk about the war like a sporting event, I truly believe that you should be forced to fight on the frontlines

  • Chana [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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    One of the important things to understand re: political class “decisions” is that it is nearly always a de facto collaboration with the ruling class and the state bureaucracy. Even if they don’t consult the latter (and they always do), the limits of their actions are set by the latter. The “guardrails” are set by them essentially threatening to destroy “the economy”, pull support, assassination, and so on. So every action taken for any substantial period of time happens with the consent of all 3.

    But all 3 don’t need to have the same motivations. They are all interested in their own outcomes, they only need to see something in it for themselves. And even then each group is subdivided, they only need to predominately see something in it for them.

    So as a result, you can see the proximal reason(s) for decisions quite clearly fairly often. Of course they’re going to boost cops’ funding, for example. They’re the state violence beloved by bourgeois interests. They’re the state apparatus that feeds the bureaucracy and much of the bureaucracy sees a need to control a population that will be increasingly desperate. Every politician sees police as in their own personal interest, even, thinking they’re the only thing between them and assassination (or may literally be their assassins if they don’t play ball). The funding going to cops often feeds the MIC, as the “donations” of “excess” coincide with “modernization” pushes, i.e. more procurement.

    So, with Iran, the answer is surely “many reasons”, many of those you list and others here list are likely true. Iran poses a “threat” due to its long-term intentional isolation by imperialists beginning with its successful attempt at independence from them. The US and its cronies constantly go after such states and it has nothing to do with principals. They go after communists, monarchies, countries de facto run by clergies, and bourgeois democracies alike. That “independence” is always perceived as a threat because what it really entails is a move away from domination by those imperialists when they need to move chips around to maintain their status, and most importantly, ruling class status. A free Iran began mostly as a threat to oil interests, imperialists fought each other over it, from the British to the fledgling imperialist tsars to the US. Without imperialist ownership, profits through exploitation go to Iran, not the imperialists. And oil itself became a means of domination, a monopoly on energy and industrial production that could be turned into a financial weapon, largely by the imperialists. Isolation imposed by the imperialists also meant that Iran needed to maintain militarization and basic sovereignty as they were encircled, so constant action/reaction reinforced the designation of enemy state and the drawing up of plans of military and economic ruin.

    The real question is “why now?” and honestly that truly could be that the Rubio faction is going ham and got full of themselves regarding their desire to do smash and grabs and just generally go after its list of enemy (read: independent) states. And Trump is fairly stupid and decrepit on top of all the abhorrent and violent things about him. It really could be a political class blunder, but again, it’s all within the guardrails of the ruling class and bureaucracy. Otherwise there would be, at minimum, signs of fracture. The bourgeois press would be running constant attacks on the war, they’d be pushing for ways out, they’d be blaming Trump, etc. Donors would be pulling out. Capital flow would be changing in unique ways. Generally speaking, none of that is happening.

  • chgxvjh [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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    I’d assume they want more Emirates.

    The frequent change of course indicates to me that someone is getting rich from market manipulation.

    I don’t think it’s much like Ukraine. More like other wars in the middle east. The US has let the Ukraine do almost all of the work in the Ukraine war. Maybe some parallels to Israel but US seems more active.

  • SerLava [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    6 days ago

    I think the primary reason is that Israel wants to cripple Iran and stop it from projecting power, so that it can create Greater Israel. The rest is just stuff to persuade the Trump administration.

    • infuziSporg [e/em/eir]@hexbear.net
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      6 days ago

      This doesn’t seem to explain why we see the full-intensity war now, instead of last summer. Or is it just a matter of Isra*el keeping up the pressure until something bubbles over somewhere?