• FuckyWucky [none/use name]
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    10 months ago

    “I know that after my death a pile of rubbish will be heaped on my grave, but the wind of History will sooner or later sweep it away without mercy.”

    -stalin-bummed

    • Awoo [she/her]
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      9010 months ago

      There’s a reason they do everything in their power to convince people to avoid reading anything he actually wrote and forming their own opinion.

      It’s become even more imperative that they try and get people not to do that the longer their propaganda has gone on, because the moment a person does engage with him in a proper academic and mature way is the moment that it becomes clear how much is pure propaganda. This is deeply damaging to liberalism because it sets in light just how much should be questioned, it highlights the scale of it all.

    • thethirdgracchi [he/him, they/them]
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      6210 months ago

      Stalin: You exaggerate. We have no especially high esteem for everything American, but we do respect the efficiency that the Americans display in everything in industry, in technology, in literature and in life. We never forget that the U.S.A. is a capitalist country. But among the Americans there are many people who are mentally and physically healthy who are healthy in their whole approach to work, to the job on hand. That efficiency, that simplicity, strikes a responsive chord in our hearts. Despite the fact that America is a highly developed capitalist country, the habits prevailing in its industry, the practices existing in productive processes, have an element of democracy about them, which cannot be said of the old European capitalist countries, where the haughty spirit of the feudal aristocracy is still alive.

      That cannot be said of America, which is a country of “free colonists,” without landlords and without aristocrats. Hence the sound and comparatively simple habits in American productive life. Our business executives of working-class origin who have visited America at once noted this trait. They relate, not without a certain agreeable surprise, that on a production job in America it is difficult to distinguish an engineer from a worker by outward appearance. That pleases them, of course.

      snipes-hesitation

    • MaoTheLawn [any, any]
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      10 months ago

      H.G Wells is an OG one true leftist hexbearite:

      “It seems to me that I am more to the Left than you, Mr. Stalin; I think the old system is nearer to its end than you think.”

      Aside from that, Stalin is such a great orator… However, his skill in speaking can’t be put only down to an ability to speak plainly and clearly - rather it is the solidness of his theories and robust historical knowledge that makes it easy for him to speak with such authority and precision.

      That is why liberal politicians fail so horribly in their seethrough speeches. They are not backed by actual facts or historically materialist theory. By nature of their juxtaposition as defenders of capital AND supposed servants of the people, they can be nothing other than duplicitous.

      I wager that there is not a mainstream politician in the U.S or the U.K that could survive even 20 minutes questioning by Stalin without being made to look a bludgeoned fool. Biden would last about 14 seconds before keeling over and dying.

  • Hohsia [he/him]
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    10 months ago

    It really feels like there’s a point where amerikkkan propaganda destroys history and I think we’ve reached that with Stalin

    • Awoo [she/her]
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      5410 months ago

      It’s a matter of quantity of people the propaganda reaches.

      In terms of quality, socialists repeatedly have success making an impact on this topic on other people. Right now there are people reading some of the comments in this post, particularly the longer comments, and they are genuinely being impacted by some of the things they learn or points made. Often silently.

      The main issue is primarily the quantity of people that their propaganda reaches over the quantity of people that socialists can try to educate in a deeper and more meaningful way. I think it’s worth looking outside the US though, across Europe most takes are significantly more measured, and across parts of the global south you get views completely untainted by the US propaganda because it doesn’t reach them at all. Don’t despair.

      • ThereRisesARedStar [she/her, they/them]
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        3010 months ago

        Thats one of the things he generally did bad on, but he did massively improve the qol of impoverished queer folks, and improved the qol of queer folks in liberated territories.

        • Lols [they/them]
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          610 months ago

          saying that someone who recriminalised homosexuality did nothing wrong ‘because he improved the general quality of life’ sounds suspiciously like queer folk just being the cost of doing business

          • RollaD20 [comrade/them, any]
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            10 months ago

            Yes Stalin was homophobic. He deserves criticism for this. Welcome to most people and countries (especially the Christian ones). I find it incredible that despite the fucking travesty that is the quality of life for queer folk in the USA, especially for black; indigenous; non-white peoples, certain folk have the gall to look back at a man born over 100 years ago, son to a poor family in a nation under the boot of Russian Empire and criticize him for not having perfect values when the common narrative of him as a monster is disrupted. Of course he wasn’t perfect, of course he deserves criticism where criticism is due. However, there are a significant set of actions which deserve praise, especially relative to his common depiction.

            That being said, it’s not as if socialist governments that do well when it comes to queer rights are lauded for their efforts. The DDR made significant strides for the queer community yet is rarely (if ever) applauded in the west for this. Cuba still manages to get attacked on this front despite having the most progressive stance on the matter today. This criticism in this context never feels in good faith, it feels desperate and reaching for a way to conflate socialists and fascists.

            • Lols [they/them]
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              10 months ago

              Welcome to most people and countries (especially the Christian ones).|

              I find it incredible that despite the fucking travesty that is the quality of life for queer folk in the USA

              i wasn’t comparing stalins policies to other countries, people or the USA, i was commenting on ‘stalin did nothing wrong’

              certain folk have the gall to look back at a man born over 100 years ago, son to a poor family in a nation under the boot of Russian Empire and criticize him for not having perfect values when the common narrative of him as a monster is disrupted

              i wasnt commenting on him not being a monster, i was commenting on ‘stalin did nothing wrong’

              That being said, it’s not as if socialist governments that do well when it comes to queer rights are lauded for their efforts. The DDR made significant strides for the queer community yet is rarely (if ever) applauded in the west for this. Cuba still manages to get attacked on this front despite having the most progressive stance on the matter today. This criticism in this context never feels in good faith, it feels desperate and reaching for a way to conflate socialists and fascists.

              i wasnt commenting on socialists or their policies, i was commenting on ‘stalin did nothing wrong’

              • Goadstool [he/him, comrade/them]
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                1210 months ago

                congratulations, you discovered the flaw in an extremely serious statement made on the internet which is in no way a meme meant almost entirely to agitate propagandized libs

                enjoy this portrait I drew of you as an award: smuglord

                • Lols [they/them]
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                  10 months ago

                  i didnt figure it was until folks actually defended it seemingly completely genuinely

                  you can tell because “its true, generally good guy that made great strides for lgbtq folks” is actually also not an extremely serious statement

              • RollaD20 [comrade/them, any]
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                310 months ago

                This criticism in this context never feels in good faith, it feels desperate and reaching for a way to conflate socialists and fascists.

                • Lols [they/them]
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                  110 months ago

                  never actually accepting criticism of inhumane policies as being done in good faith when its the wrong people being criticised undermines the whole ‘critical support’ schpiel

                  i dont think socialists and fascists are totally just the same thing, i dont think leftists are actually all closeted homophobes or even half as likely to be as the right

                  i think that framing one guy who pushed extreme anti lgbtq policies as having done nothing wrong is unhealthy and disturbing, especially since ive seen several hexbears completely unaware of it his anti LGBTQ policies, or completely convinced that him having said policies was actually just a shitlib lie

          • Rod_Blagojevic [none/use name]
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            510 months ago

            That is true, but I still like it as a retort to lib criticism of Stalin that almost always involves something that didn’t really happen anyway. As far as Stalin being homophobic, I don’t know anything about it, but I do know that he knew that the false scarcity and false precariousness created by his capitalist and feudal enemies is what causes reactionary thought to flourish.

            • Lols [they/them]
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              110 months ago

              I still like it as a retort to lib criticism of Stalin that almost always involves something that didn’t really happen anyway

              I don’t know anything about it,

              do you reckon that waving criticisms off as ‘almost always involving something that didn’t really happen anyway’ while not knowing anything about whats being criticised is a winning strategy, or that exclusively learning about the wholesome, sanitary parts of a persons actions, statements, ideals and beliefs is a healthy way to approach historical figures

              heres some reading if youre interested, from a source youll probably actually appreciate

      • blight [any]
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        10 months ago

        listen if all those unborn unconceived potential nazi children wanted grain they should have brought their own spoon stalin-comical-spoon

  • Alaskaball [comrade/them]
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    4310 months ago

    folks if you look below the post topic, but right above the comment box, you’ll see

    cross-posted to: memes@lemmygrad.ml memes@lemmy.ml

    if you click one of them you’ll go to the cross-posted post where you have the opportunity to respectfully engage with users whom may not know about the discussions we’ve had here.

  • @LordBullingdon@hexbear.net
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    2410 months ago

    Unfortunately poverty is something that most people only seem to understand by experience. Liberals will condemn racial apartheid even as they accept economic apartheid as the natural order of things or an insoluble problem. In truth within their ideology it is insoluble, and perhaps that’s the problem - it’s possible to reject bigotry without confronting and throwing out the ideology itself, but to accept the reality of poverty is to be forced to condemn the system which demands it.