• Keld [he/him, any]@hexbear.net
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      1 day ago

      In the narrative we get jesus is accused by Jews (The pharisees) and brought to trial to be judged by Pontius Pilate who washes his hand of the affair leaving it to the Jews, they are then offered that either Jesus or someone else (I think Barnabas, but it’s been a while since I cared about biblical stuff) be spared and the Jews pick the other guy. The Romans are therefore seen as a tool by which the Jews kill Jesus by some, or at least partly guilty. I’m not advocating for this view, I’m explaining

    • Hexboare [they/them]@hexbear.net
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      I don’t know why this is contentious, the Bible is pretty clear on this - Jesus went through a religious trial and then they took him to the Roman governor to seek the death penalty.

      The Roman governor questioned Jesus, shrugged and let a crowd [of Jews, as you would expect] decide whether Jesus or another bloke should be crucified.

      The saying “live by the sword, die by the sword” comes in response to the Jewish religious ‘police’ chopping off the ear of a servant while arresting Jesus.

      I would say technically god killed Jesus, but the Christian god started off a Jewish god so arguably still killed by Jews.

      • Outdoor_Catgirl [she/her, they/them]@hexbear.net
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        The people executed by the Spanish inquisition were not directly executed by the church/inquisition, they were handed off to the government to do that because it was the responsibility of the crown to carry out executions. No one would say that the church was not responsible for the executions.

      • Carl [he/him]@hexbear.net
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        I don’t think it’s contentious on the facts of the story, but rather the statement is a problem because it carries with it hundreds of years of people saying that all Jews are responsible for the actions of the religious authorities of Judea in the 1st century CE and therefore antisemitism is justified. This belief is commonly held and expressed by Christian antisemites, but is obviously wrong and bigoted, so people argue against it - the idea the Pontius Pilate is responsible for Jesus’ death is just a bad argument, you might as well blame Herod who had the opportunity to punish/pardon Jesus but opted to send him back to Pilate.

      • Either something about the Pharisees, aka the Jewish Evangelists, pulling Roman strings or that they set a murderer free instead of Jesus.

        I don’t get it, because the whole point of Jesus existence is to be tortured and killed for the sins of humanity, so all may be forgiven and go to heaven.

        Not killing Jesus would have meant eternal damnation for all.

        Once again, Christians who shout the most about Christianity understand Christianity the least.

      • Crucible [he/him, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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        Genuinely most of the biblical reasoning I’ve seen used is that when Pilate says ‘I wash my hands of you’ it made the Pharisees responsible even though it was still Roman soldiers who did it, and that is not even close to how sin and blame works in either Judaism or Christianity

      • Keld [he/him, any]@hexbear.net
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        Jews brought Jesus to the Romans in the bible. Jewish religious authorities asked the Romans to judge and kill him. The idea is then that for this sin the Jews are forever guilty. Sort of like an extra ethnic original sin. Judas does get roped into some antisemitism stuff, but usually not the biblical stuff since all the disciples were Jews.