So, I need to annoy people more is what i’m hearing?
Yes, but just annoy someone slightly taller than you. Then they will annoy someone slightly taller than them.
Edit: I apologize, I didn’t click to enlarge the graphic so I didnt see the words. All I saw was the picture of the bunny with the dominoes.
And I was reading down the comments and wondered why everyone’s getting political about this bunny-dominoes picture 🤣
105% of the time when someone in a public space says “Let’s not talk politics” or “Let’s not make this political” they are horrible MAGA-aligned morons or incel chuds who have outrageously stupid or hateful ideals.
That’s really curious isn’t it. I don’t think I’ve ever seen the reverse, you absolutely never see someone start spouting anti-equality BS in a game subreddit and all the leftists go “whoa whoa, this isn’t the place for that, can’t we all just enjoy our games without making it political.”
I’ve said it when I know I’m next to some maga idiot and it’s we either don’t talk politics or SippyCup catches himself a felony
105% of the time when someone in a public space says “Let’s not talk politics” or “Let’s not make this political” they are horrible MAGA-aligned morons or incel chuds who have outrageously stupid or hateful ideals.
Might just be where I’m from, but they’re more often neoliberal “don’t rock the boat” ghouls who care more about profits than any kind of ideological mission. Shit can suddenly get very political when it scratches their personal itch. They just don’t want anyone else arguing about politics when they should be putting up billables.
you absolutely never see someone start spouting anti-equality BS in a game subreddit and all the leftists go “whoa whoa, this isn’t the place for that, can’t we all just enjoy our games without making it political.”
Not in those words, but I definitely hear the periodic “okay, tone it down, this is different” whenever a hobby treads into the problematic. The fall-back line of “No such thing as ethical consumption under capitalism” was a balm for whatever it is you were doing that wasn’t ideologically kosher.
On the flip side, I’ve seen people blow up at one another over a political divide - even a purely rhetorical one (arguing whether Dark Elves or Orcs are a racist trope, complaining about the implications of Monopoly or Catan, getting on a high horse about a popular movie or song). The debate over whether “Let It Snow” condones date rape is a popular college age struggle session.
Eventually people just don’t want to hear it rehashed for the thousandth time.
On the flip side, I’ve seen people blow up at one another over a political divide - even a purely rhetorical one (arguing whether Dark Elves or Orcs are a racist trope, complaining about the implications of Monopoly or Catan, getting on a high horse about a popular movie or song). The debate over whether “Let It Snow” condones date rape is a popular college age struggle session.
Oh my god! Yes, you can look at orcs and goblins as racist tropes and stand ins, and those can be fun campaigns to run and explore alternative takes and deep reflective moments, but sometimes it’s just easier to say the group wants a kick-in-the-door style dungeon crawl and the enemies are evil.
Also, wasn’t the debate over ‘baby, it’s cold outside,’ not ‘let it snow?’
Excuse me, that was it
the whole idea that discussing politics is lame is a neoliberal brainworm.
Don’t discuss politics with your family, just enjoy the time! — okay weird but sure
Don’t talk politics with your friends — what the hell why not
No politics at work — that’s a deeply political place wtf are we doing
When people say no politics, that means no arguing. This applies to office politics, family politics, and of course government politics.
which ends up just meaning the racist uncle gets to shout his opinion and don’t you dare tell him he is wrong.
Fuck him, let him be wrong. In the Midwest we just ignore that person and they end up passed out on the couch by 5pm.
let us be right instead, then.
part of the problem is because talking solution politics = annoying please stop, but racist/fascist rant = hes like this just let him be.
i can trace some parallels with our current conundrum.
The no arguing thing is key. Everyone eventually finds a topic that they don’t agree on, because politics, in the greek philosophy (aristotle based) sense of the word (I actually loved nicomachean ethics), is about the pursuit of the good life writ large. The chances of two people believing in the exact same life goals is almost zero, so there will be a fundamental disagreement at some point that, because we are talking about using governmental authority as a cudgel (in the modern sense of the word politics) to bring about a ‘good life’ for society, will cause a lot of friction.
In environments where we can’t control who we interact with, and that are semi-public with an ‘audience,’ such as work and family dinners, it’s just easier to say no politics and focus on the agreed areas of shared interests. Otherwise those little frictions can build into socially driven, highly charged arguments.
Keep political discussions to where everyone can easily walk away, where it’s one-on-one, or where everybody comes wanting to talk politics, and things are fine.
The only place to discuss politics is the same place we’re supposed to talk about gun violence.
A concrete, soundproof bunker that you need to climb a 60-foot ladder down to seal yourself inside, ensure nobody is around, and whisper your grievances into a small vinyl bag, then tie the bag up with a zip-tie and place it inside a mason jar and return it to the shelf inside the bunker.
This is how you protest as an American if you want to follow established societal norms and etiquette. Anything else and it’s between 4 and 10 gunshots to the chest, face and back.
U don’t discuss politics at work cos it’s a politically unwise move that will alienate about 50% of people. That’s the only one that makes sence
Here’s the caveat.
You CAN talk to your peers and people you work with who don’t outrank you or can get you fired. In fact, this is important. You just have to know how to toe the line and not come off as some kind of radical who will push people away.
Most people I work with are DYING to express something or rant or rave about how unfair or frightening this current immigration thing is, but are afraid to broach the topic. If you just know how to ask questions and listen people will open up to you.
You don’t DECLARE your politics on a Zoom call with your mid-level manager, you ASK people how they’re doing in one-on-one calls or while having lunch together, and while people are feeling friendly or vulnerable and you give them support whatever they say, while explaining your feelings even if they run counter to theirs. You can turn people this way, but more often than not you will find allies.
It IS risky, I wouldn’t promote it, I’m just saying it’s not quite as hot-firepoker of an issue as many people think. (Your results may vary depending on your industry, state you work in, and skin color.)
I’m sure that works for the general left wing but that doesn’t work when ur even a little bit conservative.
You see conservatives are infinitely more tolerant of opinions they disagree with than the left is. I support deportations of illegal immigrants their is no way u can possibly say that without getting called a Nazi or fascist by a decent percent of the population who will go to extreme measures to fuck it life up.
Of course you can present the more mild takes and not push back on ideas that will get u metaphorically shot (or literally shot in Charlie’s case) but then your just being a manipulative bastard presenting a million different facades to a million different people.
85% of Americans support deportation of illegal immigrants charged with a violent crime. And 55% support deportation of all illegal immigrants. Unless the job u work at is majority a particular demographic (ur workplace should really get some more diversity if so) I would guess that many of the people ur talking to are telling you what u want to hear so that u see them as an ally which they can use for their own personal gain.
I have no idea where you pulled those figures, but even if they’re from a legit source, that’s not an indicator of anything meaningful. There were similar rates and ratios about segregation in the US before the Civil Rights movement. It was a “known fact” that our cultures would never mesh, and people broadly supported keeping races separated by force if necessary.
But you know what we did as a country anyway? The people advocating for human rights won, we used the military to not enforce segregation but integration, and it made a lot of people VERY mad, which we’re still feeling the effects of today. But the outcome is that we don’t blink when we pass an interracial couple in most of the US. We have a long ways to go, but the disaster everyone was worried about was exposed to be a lie and it turns out black people are fine to mix with white people. We even use the same pools and water fountains and nobody was harmed.
The problem with all of these issues is that too many people bend to the discomfort of the minority too readily. No pushback. Everyone is so scared of change that they cling to outmoded ways of thought and rationalizations for keeping “the wrong people” out of their space, but the MOMENT you change our national leadership and policy, people adapt.
People adapt to your rule, that’s why we need to enforce systems to elect the best possible rulers, because good or bad they set the tone.
Those figures you cited could be radically swung in different directions if you ask them the question differently, or say “What about your neighbor Garcia who works at the gas station, he has four kids but no papers, do you want to deport him too?” And most people who have this kind of connection to someone will go “Well…”
Our species isn’t hard-set in its values, we can change everything overnight if we worked harder together to reduce the fear and insecurity and use better emotional narratives to remind people that we’re all humans and we have plenty of physical and emotional resources to integrate people into our population. We’ve done it before, we just need better follow-through and harsher punishments against those trying to dehumanize others.
The opinion of the majority of Americans doesn’t mean anything huh? Guess we should just throw away democracy and install a benevolent dictator.
“And nobody was harmed” that’s complete bullshit. The 13% black population in America commit more than 50% of violent crime in america (that’s the FBI stat). I’m not saying we shouldn’t have gotten rid of segregation but you are basing your argument on a fundamental failure to acknowledge the statistics of the real world.
“Enforce systems to elect the best possible rulers” how does this work? Do some people get less vote? Do some people get more? That’s literally fascism. Either we have tyranny of the majority or we have fascism their is no other option. Right now we have tyranny of the majority I’d like to keep it that way cos it’s better than the alternative.
Fuck emotional narratives. Suicidal empathy will be the death of society. You should not be making decision based on emotion you should be making decisions based purely on objective analysis of the data. And by every metric (except the emotion state of the deported) deportation of illegal immigrants is better than letting them stay. Economy better, Crime better, house market better, job market better. Etc. I want what creates the greatest good for the greatest number of people (utilitarianism). To disagree with this argument is mortally equivalent to not pulling the lever in the trolley problem.
How do u make integration happen? Do you force people? Who integrates into who? Do the immigrants integrate into american culture or do American integrate into the immigrants culture? Or do we all meet happily at the end of time right in the middle? Cos we both knows that’s an appeal to an impossible fantasy. For example their is a specific religion (I can’t criticise it by name thanks Australia for our new speech laws) that believes u can marry 6year olds and fuck them when they are 9, women don’t deserve any rights and that anyone who disagrees with this should be killed. How the hell do u plan to integrate that into American culture? By force? Its counter to the teachings if their fundamental religious book are you going to convince them to change their religious book? Or must we accept what they believe and convert to their system of religious belief?
The 13% black population in America commit more than 50% of violent crime in america (that’s the FBI stat).
Oh shit, didn’t realize I was talking to a nazi. You know what, never mind.
Go learn about US history and maybe ask the important questions like “WHY” one segment of the population is both over-policed and under-represented. As I said, it’s an ongoing struggle, but racial essentialism is a NO GO. It’s evil.
You’re evil for repeating it. Get smarter you dingus, grow up. I wont see your reply.
Maybe fifty percent need to be alienated.
So you get fired but at least you can be proud while unemployed?
I’d rather work a job where people don’t support mothers being shot in the face or people carrying legal and holstered weapons don’t get shot ten times in the back after being disarmed.
That’s easy enough to say on the internet, but your recent incendiary hyperbole aside, hard to do IRL.
I don’t think even most Trump supporters would say, especially in an employment context, that they “support mothers being shot in the face or people carrying legal and holstered weapons don’t get shot ten times in the back after being disarmed.”
Even Trump said the most recent ICE killing was “unfortunate,” so your hyperbole puts even him in your camp. When you’ve built a straw-man that represents approximately 0% of the population, why even bother fighting it here except maybe for Lemmy clout?
That’s the problem it’s way more than zero percent of the population.
I don’t disagree with that statement but it’s barely relevant to the sub-topic we’re on here.
Politics means the dealings of the city. It means the people and their lives. We’ve been conditioned to immediately believe political is equal to electoralism, which is a lie.
Politics is unionizing, it’s feeding your neighbors, it’s organizing community gardens and sing alongs, it’s starting a mutual aid network to ensure every need is met. It’s all these and million more things.
Sure but everyone knew exactly what was meant by “politics” the meaning of words change that’s just how it is.
Don’t yell about politics in the work place. Just complaining about straw men is tiring.
sure, let’s just finish our grueling shift during repression by the gestapo in silence.
nothing to see here, i don’t wanna upset the colleagues with such nonsense like “politics”
Yelling and talking are different things. Don’t get into a fit is all.
i find some yellers to be justified in their anger and break from polite decorum. given circumstances and stuff.
There are virtually no current events in Germany and yelling about Americans being cray cray is not constructive or beneficial to our mental health. They are not our countrymen.
which means you can ignore all the real consequences of their global campaign?
would the rest of the world be wise if they ignored european fascism the last time around?
No. Of course not. You jump to extremes. That’s not very cash money. But it does mean that we shouldn’t base our belief in the rule of law on the American system. Foreigners are doing foreigner things all the time. You might not like it but you gotta accept that from time to time. Attention is limited and should be spent wisely.
no way im going to talk politics at work, i have work to do.
The cranky unhappy politics wonk endlessly droning on about the evils of the world are a drain on everyone else’s joy.
This may be because I’m autistic, but I think apoliticals are the most boring people in the world. Apoliticals always want to talk about the weather and their favourite reality TV show and what they did while drinking on the weekend. But My political friends talk about political stuff like science fiction, history, cool movies, fun gossip.
Politics is what humans are best at in all the animal kingdom. If a human wants to be apolitical, well they’re just not living up to their potential. I’d get just as much engaging conversation from a dog, and it would be cuter.
People like this are usually very timid and weak in emotional fortitude for talking about difficult topics, and have probably had too many arguments with people even less intelligent and it created trauma. To say nothing of the actual deliberate campaigns by many internal and external forces to poison the wells of dialogue so that everyone feels lost and afraid of politics.
I think along with the autistic spectrum comes an internal dialogue and information organization system that makes people care about more abstract concepts and ideas, which are inherently political if they involve more than one person, real or imaginary.
I don’t mind politics wonks if they have moderation and aren’t doomers.
Doomers or do-nothing liberals are the worst kind, I will take an outspoken conservative over liberals and doomers any day. At least an outspoken conservative chud I can talk to and understand and eventually break. Because I am smarter than most of them. So are you. We all are. We’re just afraid of confrontation but you can shape conversations so that these people let their guard down and actually become receptive to new perspectives if you can change their feelings.
The “safe space” sticker I have on my car has invited road rage more than once from big truck drivers. Back in GA a man just stood behind my car waiting for me to come out of a store. I have front and rear dash cams now. I don’t even think it’s that political, but I’m not taking it off.
Yes! My FUCK ICE sticker has been inspiring conversations everywhere I go. Some folks on the highway tailgate me, shaking their heads, and drive by in a fit, staring at me. I smile warmly and give a thumbs up. My neighbors are all talking to me more openly. Little tiny things can definitely sow change. Do it. I don’t give two shits if someone keys my car, America is boiling.
Back in GA a man just stood behind my car
According to ICE, you’re justified in using lethal force in this situation.
Only if it’s a lesbian who dyes her hair.
The biggest part I had to cry abt was the Fox News anchor (probably Jesse Walter) saying she had pronouns in her social media profile so she of course is Antifa and a domestic terrorist for informing the public she was she/her. She is a martyr and we will remember her and all those ICE has killed
Is this not a victim-blaming meme telling me to shut up and stay at home? The last domino is going to hit the rabbit.
I think it’s more something like if you don’t confront bigotry it’ll grow and eventually crush you.
Yeah, my first thought was that it’s a reference to how facism has grown by allowing people to discuss it in anonymous echo chambers.
The irony of this being said on lemmy is pretty special
You’re here. A fascist from a fascist server, interacting with the rest of us, how the fuck is this therefore an echo chamber?
Just because your dumb takes aren’t tolerated by the majority of Lemmy users doesn’t mean it’s an echo chamber.
In the context of news media and social media, an echo chamber is an environment or ecosystem in which participants encounter beliefs that amplify or reinforce their preexisting beliefs by communication and repetition inside a closed system and insulated from rebuttal.[2][3][4] The echo chambers function by circulating existing views without encountering opposing views, potentially leading to three cognitive biases
My instance is defederated from a lot of lemmy instances for having unpopular opinions. Ironically I’m also banned for having an unpopular opinion on unpopular opinions. My takes sent tolerated and they are removed thus making the system insulated from rebuttal.
Defederating from known arseholes isn’t the same as a closed system with no means of rebuttal.
If a pub bars known trouble makers but still allows the general public in, then it’s still a pub, as opposed to a members club.
Depends how u define trouble maker. If u define trouble maker as starts physical altercations then sure that’s fare. But much of lemmy seems to have defined trouble maker as anything further right than whoever happens to have the loudest voice at the current moment.
Edit: don’t quote Karl popper to me go read the paragraph directly after the one that everyone likes to quote and u will get his justification for tolerating my speech. That’s ignoring the fact that the paradox of tolerance applies equally as well as a justification for fascism.
Ah, OK I see that. I thought it also looked a bit like it would apply to the downward slope of social media and polarization of everyone into hate-filled groups where “no one is wrong.”
Thanks for explaining your perspective!
Hah, bunny suicides.
Forgot about this book. Was a coffee table staple in my late teens.
This makes fuck all sense.
If people don’t speak about politics, nobody ever sees any criticism
I criticised the OP without mentioning politics at all.
I disagree
Then politics for you is a meaningless concept, and not the same one that people mean when they say “don’t talk about politics in [x]” (where x is never “public”, for the record).
Actually, it’s the other way around. I have a coherent and useful definition of politics, while most people are being manipulated by a harmful meme that shapeshifts its definition so it matches whatever they don’t personally like.
It’s not useful if it causes you to misunderstand people, which you obviously have done.
If your employer’s office policy is “no politics in working hours” are you able to not get fired?
I’m perfectly capable of understanding you, I simply disagree with you.
Domino effect surely
Butterfly: a rectangular playing piece with dots indicating the numbers to match.
Not to be confused with Dominoes, which is, of course, a pizza place.
A small silence can snowball fast — that’s the scary part of the dominoes. Quiet moments matter more than they seem.
