Twenty years ago, I met a couple with a young son who decided not to let the kid have sugar. I wonder how that might have worked out for the kid now that he’s grown.
I assume the kid hit 18 and went on a sugar binge as soon as he tasted it the first time.
Anyone have experience with this?
My understanding is that, less than the sugar itself, a big issue with early exposure for children is more the presentation and marketing - sugary food is rarely beige.
The colorful presentations, often with cartoons and rainbows, tends to attract kids, pump dopamine and breed addiction until you need all the junky foods to compulsively feed the monkey. Bad early habits turning into lifelong health issues.
I got some, but my parents wouldn’t buy me junk food or sugary cereal. I had sweets on special occasions or at other people’s houses.
My sweet consumption is still pretty low, but not zero. I over-indulged a bit in my early twenties but i got over it. I have internalized their lessons and am now teaching my kids the same.
My parents (80s/90s kid) thought that sugar caused hyperactivity so I was very severely limited on what I could have. Candy for rewards at school was always sugar free and provided by my folks, when I trick or treated I was only given Halloween night to go buck wild and then the remainder was set aside as a one-a-day treat after dinner assuming I was good that day. I think the whole sugar>hyperactivity thing was debunked but they never really changed their tune on it. Once I was able to buy my own food I developed a bit of a sweet tooth, but I ironically am far more dependent on caffeine than sugar in my daily consumption. In my 40s now, not unhealthy or overweight and if I ever get around to improving my diet it will be reducing my alcohol intake.
My kid is somewhat strange in that she doesn’t want sugary stuff. She doesn’t like things that are “too sweet”.
A child who grows up without any sugar might just be an adult who has no sugar cravings.
Can’t blame them. Most sugary stuff these days has so much sugar it tastes like acid. Best case scenario it tastes like plain sugar.
I wasn’t raised without sugar but with very little and with the understanding it’s not food.
When I was given some marshmallows as a kid I wasn’t sure if this edible or Styrofoam type packaging material.
Doing fine today, for a couple years I am not eating candy. No jam no snacks, black coffee, soda in the zero version here and there. Fruit is the only way perhaps I get sugar.
Late 20s I got some tooth issues despite not eating sugar. Not sure how that happens, carbs I guess.
I never missed anything prefer salty spicy foods or umami.
Saliva breaks down starch in your mouth to sugar! Spit has the enzyme amylase, so the longer u chew starchy foods the more sugary it becomes before u swallow!
Do you drink a lot of sparkling water. I’ve heard the carbonation is part of what causes tooth decay.
In that carbonic acid is present, sure. Seltzer water is 100 to 1000 times less acidic than typical cola and doesn’t feed the cavity-causing bacteria so it’s a pretty small part of the problem.
That’s crazy, that’s the first I heard of that. What I remember from my college classes covering food is that processed grains are on of the most common issues with tooth decay.
My understanding is that carbonation isn’t a problem, it’s the acidity that you get in colas, even the sugar-free variety, that can damage teeth.
Backstory: I’m not strict. I’m not a task master. I don’t helicopter. I don’t spank. I don’t yell. I rarely punish, and they are always meant to build, not tear-down.
My kids got a little candy as a desert after dinner when they were small, no sodas. After 5 or so they were allowed a little candy as desert after dinner and lunch. We always stocked big bulk versions of their favorite candies. They got to choose these bulk candies.
I rationed till 6 and then they were allowed to just grab whatever they wanted after a meal, with the understanding that if they consistently went wild with it then I would go back to the job to help them regain control.
They also understood that if they tore through the candy or snuck candy, that was understandable, but we would have to stop getting the bulk candy because too much candy hurts us and we would do what we needed to ensure we are safe and healthy. If control can’t be gained with it home, it can be gained once a month at the store by simply not buying it. We would still get candy, but far less often, maybe at a stop for gas or whatever.
They were allowed to eat as much as they ever wanted on special occasions, Halloween, parties, last day of school, vacations, etc. They learned early on how unpleasant it was to go too far with this.
Finally, they were allowed any time to say "I think I want a little candy, can I grab a few (candy type)? And I would make a judgement call based on the days intake and other factors. Surprisingly, they very very rarely used this, even though I mostly always agreed.
Other than having to say “ooh that was a bit much, be more careful next time” sometimes early-on, they became completely hands off with candy and always kept it within reason for their size. If they were unsure, they would ask me to look at what they got. If it was to much, they still got it, always with a “that’s ok, next time get less. remember it’s not what we do on occasion that matters much, it’s what we do every day. So let’s make sure we don’t do this every day.”
I anchored all this to measurable metrics they could understand and see, calories. IDGAF what dessert you eat, you get ~100 calories each meal to spend. That’s 6 pieces of gum whenever and however you want them, 6 jolly ranchers, two Oreos, etc.
I essentially mirrored control for them while still letting them have control and a wide choice themselves to exercise within that dynamic.
I knew they would be good when we were at the grocery with my best friend picking up meat for bbq and games all day. When we got to the register he said
“ooh, hey guys get whatever you want” gesturing to the prodigious impulse buy candy display
“We have candy at home”
“But there is so much stuff here. You can get different candy”
“Hmm”Shocked, I chime in “guys, this is a special occasion, you can eat as much of whatever you want. And, (friend) is paying.” Thinking maybe they didn’t realize it was a party day, or they were worried about cost.
“Well, we have what we want at home. So, we’ll just get some there.”
“You can have that too, and get something here. it’s a party.”
“We’re good, but thank you.”He was just, floored. I was beaming. Not because they executed control, they were well into that, but because I knew I had their needs beyond met, and through their lives even when I cease to be able to help them, they would be able to meet their needs better than I ever could.
My oldest is in their 20s. My youngest in their teens. All of them regulate junk of any kind, sugar, media, etc, easily. This is one area I fucking aced as a parent.
A pretty big area to ace :)
Thank you, genuinely.
You have to pick where you spend your resource points. We only get so many. Add to the good stuff you were given, minimize the bad stuff you were given, and pass it on. You’ll never get everything, but that’s ok, the next generation will do this too.
Look 7 generations out, each direction. You’re small, but be a reliable stitch.
What’s helicopter?
I think in this context it means to be a “helicopter parent”. One that hovers over their child ready to act. I compare it to a smothering style of parenting
My aunt and uncle would only very rarely allow my cousins to have sugary foods, though it was treated largely a form of abuse. My aunt and uncle were morbidly obese junk food junkies, their house was always full of candy, cakes, donuts, little debbie snacks, pudding, icecream, you name it, they had it, but my cousins weren’t allowed to have any except in very rare instances. They’d take the kids out to trick or treat, my cousins would come back home with a giant bag of candy, but they’d only be allowed to have 1 piece each – my aunt and uncle got the rest. One time my aunt asked the family to make homemade milkshakes for her birthday, but then insisted my cousins could not have any.
Growing up, the cousins maintained a healthy weight and honestly other than the fact that we’d sneak them sweet snacks whenever we could, they didn’t seem to have a particularly problematic issue with food.
However, they both put on an enormous amount of weight once they left home for college. Last I saw, which has admittedly been awhile (pre-covid), they were both morbidly obese.
Granted, I’m in the USA, so even folks who were normal weight as kids and didn’t grow up in abusive homes or have restrictive diets end up becoming obese / morbidly obese from poor diets and overeating as adults.
We’re all fat and our teeth have been mostly replaced with crowns. And even though we’re in our fifties, our attitude towards sugary food is incredibly unhealthy, because we didn’t learn to eat it in moderation, we learned to take advantage of any opportunity that offered us sugary food.
Happy, uh, cake day
You also lived during the “fat” craze. Fat was deemed bad so manufacturers filled their food with sugar so they could market it as low fat.
It’s Capitalism all the way down
The joys of Scarsdale…
Fuck Kellogg and the Seventh Day Adventists.
Religious zealots ruin everything.
Well, religions ruin everything but they require puppets to do the work.
I mean I agree with the sentiment, but the seventh day Adventists were specifically making really low sugar, very bland cereals because they thought that would make people less horny or something. I don’t think they are to blame for high sugar content
Low sugar doesn’t mean low carb and they promoted carb heavy diets over proteins and fats which are absolutely essential. They infiltrated organizations to push scientifically unsound bullshit which led to the obesity epidemic.
What? Young earth creationists being unscientific??
Maybe god told them in a vision to cause the obesity epidemic
Little Debbie disagrees. https://www.nadadventist.org/news/southern-adventist-university-names-ruth-mckee-school-business-after-bakery-co-founder/
blame for high sugar content
And you should be using present tense, they directly own about 40 brands, more if you count 7da founded companies, or so many if owned by a 7da family.
What did the Seventh Day Adventists do?
They’re directly responsible for the demonization of meat and fats which led to carb heavy diet recommendations which, in turn, caused the obesity epidemic.
Also, they’re a bunch of religious zealots which are categorically a threat to egalitarian democratic societies.
How dare you call me out like that.
Sort of a weird way of doing it, but my mom didn’t allow sugary breakfast cereals. Adding sugar to cereals was fine, but the only cereals we kept in the house were the basic ones. Rice crispies, bran flakes, Chex of different varieties, etc…
I actually prefer the unsweetened cereals now. Most cereals are cloyingly sweet by my standards. My go-to is usually plain Weetabix or bran flakes.
We did that too. Even when you add table sugar to cereal, you’re probably not scooping on the 5 teaspoons of sugar that you get from one of those individual cups of Frosted Flakes. It’s outrageous how sweet they makes this stuff.
I wasn’t allowed to have sugar because I was hypoglycemic as a kid. I’d get a burst of energy and then crash out. It almost put me in a coma once and I had to visit the hospital a few times.
I’d still sneak candy anytime I could!
As an adult, I don’t even associate candy with food. To my brain, it’s poison. I’m not like obsessive or anything but I don’t really eat sweets to this day even though I haven’t had any blood sugar problems as an adult.
I do eat some things with some added sugar of course but that’s about it.
Once I was dating a woman that had diabetes and to support her, we both cut out added sugar and carbs for 1 month. That was a crazy experience! I literally went through physical and mental withdrawals! Eventually my sense of taste became so different that I remember baby carrots tasting like they were dipped in sugar water! Once I stopped the diet it took weeks for me to start tasting things normally again.
Oh, speaking of sugar and taste, I had a similar experience with everything tasting like sugar when I came home from a 1 month vacation in Spain where I ate pretty normally. The amount of sugar added to everything in the US is fucking gross!
My parents were very anti-sugar/processed foods and extremely controlling of our diet, there was a lock on the pantry door and everything (which is how I learned to pick locks 😉). All of us went wild in adulthood. All of us are obese except my sister who runs a half marathon per day. The funny thing is my parents never ate healthy, they would devour desserts at work and hide candy in their bedroom closet. My dad still drinks a gallon of chocolate milk per week
Yeah, that’s usually what bans do for you in the long run. And while the bans are in effect, the policy makers are hoarding all of it to themselves.
Yeah, my wife still has food hoarding tendencies, because of her parents. Her mom was strict about mealtimes, and her dad was a habitual snacker. So any snacks she got for herself would inevitably be locked away and eaten by her dad.
So now she has food stashed all over the place in our apartment. I’ll start vacuuming, and find a box of cereal under the couch. I’ll make the bed, and find a candy bar under her side of the mattress. Or the cat will casually wander out of the office, carrying a piece of food that dug up somewhere.
We did no added sugar until our kids were 2. We don’t regulate much anymore but it seems like they still love sweet things but don’t crave it or overindulge like I used to when I was their age. A lot of neural development happens early on
I feel like this is a reasonable response. Early childhood is an easier time to regulate sugar intake and definitely developmentally crucial so you don’t want any extra unhealthy foods complicating things.
I was raised similarly and have a pretty healthy relationship with sugar today. I just always worried about the kids whose parents freaked out about them having a soda at a birthday party when they were like 8 or something. I understand policing sugar up to maybe grade school, but past that definitely has a negative effect emotionally and can lead to kids bingeing when they’re cut loose.
That reminds me, I avoided exposing my son to soft drinks until he was maybe 5yo. As a result he didn’t like soft drinks and wouldn’t touch them until he was about 12yo. Fortunately here in Australia all birthday parties also offer cordial - artificial fruit juice, but not carbonated.
Now he drinks as much as he wants, which is probably a can or 2 per week.
That’s kind of how I was. I did go through a root beer kick in my 20s but that was still pretty tame and mostly just like sampling a couple different ones a week. I still have my favorites I’ll buy six packs of every couple to few months lol but, for the most part, it’s not something I seek out aside from that. I seem to like the less sweet root beers as well, so maybe that’s connected.
Neural pathways alone, the difference between “I LOVE sugar” being written into your source code to “I like sugar” as a browser extension.
I’m thinking there must be a study somewhere.
And indeed there is, where they studied people who were born just before and after the end of WW2 sugar rationing in the UK:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/39480913/
Those people are into their 70s and 80s now, so the long term health outcomes are well documented:
…we found that early-life rationing reduced type 2 diabetes and hypertension risk by about 35 and 20% and delayed disease onset by 4 and 2 years, respectively. Protection was evident with in utero exposure and increased with postnatal sugar restriction, especially after 6 months, when eating of solid foods likely began. In utero sugar rationing alone accounted for about one-third of the risk reduction.
Thank you. I know I shouldn’t be surprised this doesn’t have more than 10% of the upvotes for anecdotal “I didn’t get sugar when I was a kid, so my adult onset diabetes and obesity is clearly my parents fault.” But, I’m a little disappointed.
But, it’s not really what I asked. I asked for experience, not studies. I like the anecdotes.
There’s whole news ecosystems based on information based on anecdotes, as opposed to data driven studies.
Surprised Hershey isn’t astro turfiing us with made-up horrors of sugar deprivation.
Hats of to you for finding the study, and hats off to the one that conducted it. These are some pretty big numbers for a short period of not feeding them sugar.
It’s just Puritanism and has all of the drawbacks of an overreaching authority.
Those kids usally binge on sugar once they hit adolescence and are away from thier parents. Great way to create a substance abuse issue. It’s what happens every time you do shit like this.
Prohibition is a method of control that requires a hell of a lot of restrictions to work. And even then it has a high failure rate.
Counterpoint, I see parents giving sodas to toddlers all the time. Reminiscent of that scene in Idiocracy where a parent tries to get their baby to drink Brawndo.
But sugar can cause a slew of problems in kids like childhood obesity, diabetes and
hyperactivitymood swings due to changes in blood sugar levels. The sugar industry has done its best to convince people it’s harmless while packing cheap foods full of it to make it taste better. Countries that consume large amounts of cheap foods like the US have higher obesity rates.Blah blah moderation and all that, but when all you can afford is the cheap shit it’s harder to avoid sugars. Kids finding they might have a sweet tooth when they get older is a tiny concern.
FWIW, it’s a myth that sugar causes hyperactivity. But it’s been shown in studies that parents who believe the myth are more likely to perceive their children’s behaviour as hyperactive when they’ve had sugar.
I think there is evidence that some artificial food additives can have that effect in some people, though.
You’re right, it should probably say mood swings due to changes in blood sugar levels instead as that’s more accurate
My mom kept the fridge stocked with sodas when I was a kid, mostly because I had friends over often and she wanted them to feel welcome. I usually drank soda because it was convenient; quick, cold, no dishes. Over years I downed thousands of sodas. It didn’t even occur to me that I didn’t even like it that much.
Now I drink so much water. I’ll have a soda a few times a year, but if I’m thirsty water is king. I feel like a kid who got caught smoking forced to smoke a whole pack.
My family growing up went to having 1l of coke for everyone to share on Sundays, when shit was super expensive, to 600ml or more per person per meal over about 10 years when it got cheaper. I got myself to the point that I would go to a friend’s house, and feel thirsty and refuse to drink water, which was the only thing available. That’s when I noticed my family had a problem.
I didn’t quit cold turkey, but when I reached 26 I remember drinking soft drinks less than once per year. Best decision ever. My mum didn’t go over weight not sure how, but developed diabetes. Only then she switched to diet coke, but kept drinking that like I drink water.
Zero calorie soda tastes good, which makes me not trust it at all.
Well that doesn’t sound like a good faith argument.
Dosent to me at all
They didnt even really counter your point, they gave another perspective to form a stronger argument of what your message was already saying
Parents should teach and guide their children moderation, especially for such common and addictive substances like sugar, especially when without moderation serious health and quality of life damages can apply
If a parents goal is to raise healthy humans with a high quality of life - they should be teaching and guiding children into moderation, not prohibition and the shame that goes with it, not hedonism and the shamelessness that goes with that
Its not that sugar is some fearful substance that should be prohobited outright, but its also not a substance without issue and should be moderated and controlled if modersation is not yet possible for such a still-developing human
There are many such substances that need this parental guidance, sugar is just the most obvious one to younh parents - a toddler probably/hopefully isnt hitting a 40 or a roach
They didn’t address my point at all and went for the extreme opposite. As if it was a gotcha.
One of the things that makes me ignore my mastodon account is how quickly people take offence there, even going so far as to try to shut down conversation threads on their posts as though they don’t expect any depth or variant viewpoints. While there are lots of “reply guy” types over there, even the hint of disagreement, perceived or real, is seen as objectionable.
This response is similar.
The world must look so small and scary from your perspective if you think this was opposition to you. Its not.
Nah man, I just dislike when people do shit like he did thinking they have a point.
Also nice knee jerk reaction.
Edit: in what world is a counterpoint agreement?
This is so frustrating
The commenter was building on top of your argument
You said prohibition wasnt healthy
They said total absence of control wasnt healthy
They implicitly agreed with you that prohibition wasnt healthy
I then spell it out for you that the message being built, that almost certainly you also agree with, is that moderation is the answer.
A counterpoint turns a random point into a line, a line into a polygon, a polygon into a solid, etc.
That counterpoint gave your message an extra and important dimmension. They thought your message was correct but lacking neccisary nuance.
For some reason you got peeved with that, and i think that looks poorly on you, not anyone else.
I’d be interested to read some real literature on this. Obviously moderation is the best behavioral choice in the context of life and society, while no refined sugar is obviously the best choice for health.
But if you had two groups of kids, one who was given no sugar and one who was given too much sugar, I bet the former group ends up healthier the vast majority of the time.
I think the real issue is simply that excess calories (and sugary foods are highly dense in calories) leads to obesity. And obesity in childhood lends itself to continued obesity through adulthood, thus higher rates of things like diabetes and high blood pressure.
I think the whole argument about sugar itself is a bit of a moot point. It all comes down to whether or not you let your child become obese while you are still under their care.
I grew up in a household with a lot of sugar. I turned out just fine. Two of my siblings struggle a lot with obesity, and one has been overweight since childhood.
I’ve seen the opposite be true. Family members that grew up with Candy/Sugar never left it behind and have impulse control issues that led to substance problems.
Those that had very limited sweet stuff, are able to moderate, or don’t enjoy sweets as much, and haven’t had substance issues.
I think the key factor in substance issues tgough is the persons genetic predisposition and trama.
What is trama?
Like trauma but U weren’t involved
Thank god!
Those kids usally binge on sugar once they hit adolescence and are away from thier parents
Was an absolute soda chugging fiend in college, until a root canal brought me down to earth.
Bingo!
I wasn’t allowed much sugar as a kid and I still have all of my teeth and no fillings at 48. Only repair work is from not wearing a gum shield when kickboxing.
