Matthew killed himself, virtually all addicts who live past their twenties have seen other addicts die, and addicts know the dangers every time they choose to use; whether the death is from the drug itself or poor decisions made while using
In USA the drug war is now about 120 years old, have we won yet?
My drug counselors sucked, not a single one gave me any drugs. 0/10
If the drug wasn’t adulterated or fake, this should not be a charge.
People who do drugs know the risks, and are expected to behave safely. I’d never fucking k-hole around any body of water. Sorry Mathew, but that was a dumb move and you knew it.
The doctor prescribed ketamine to him unnecessarily with the intention of getting him addicted and charged him an exorbitant markup as I recall. I don’t think this was Mathew’s fault. I could be wrong, I haven’t looked into it in a while.
I could be misremembering, but wasn’t it after all of his other sources cut him off because he wanted too much? I think this was the only person willing to do it, and charged him a ton for it.
That said, doing ketamine in a bathtub is real dumb.
So the counselor got a reduced sentence for being the first one to flip. Thank god he is very sorry for the killing!
If she’d run him over with her car or raped him, no big deal. But drugs! Drugs are bad, or something, idk.
Drugs are bad mmm’kay. You shouldn’t do drugs mmm’kay.
what good does this do?
What’s your point
Guy killed a guy, gets jail
my point is that jail won’t solve anything.
Oh, in this case it will. It will stop a corrupt guy who makes money out of distributing drugs of dubious origin under the guise of safe recreational use for recovery purposes, from further putting others at risk. For a drug counselor it should be obvious that you should not distribute drugs to addicts under (almost) no circumstance.
Jail isn’t what’s doing that, revoking his license does. The jail time is just an added slap on the wrist to make the people close to Perry feel better (which is absurd considering a guy literally died, retribution doesn’t change that.) It doesn’t actually solve anything.
Which is why we won’t jail any drug dealers anywhere, or any criminal, for that matter, as it doesn’t solve anything.
Of course, drug dealers, famously reticent to distributing drugs without license.
That’s ignoring the point. Retributive justice is inherently reactive. It doesn’t improve upon any of the circumstances or motivations leading to someone committing a crime, thereby limiting it to a response only after it happens. Criminals don’t commit crimes simply because they were “born that way”. They do it because their life experiences led them to either a) believing they had to commit the crime to improve their situation, b) believing it’s justifiable in their own warped sense of right and wrong, or c) severe mental illness. There’s nothing in those causes that can’t be accounted for or treated beforehand to prevent the act from occurring at all. All jail time is doing is putting them in a pressure cooker that will inevitably lead to the people sentenced being even further handicapped in their ability to function in society.
Mind you I’m not against separating criminals from society for an appropriate amount of time entirely. It’s just that if the primary motivation with their sentence is punishment, you shouldn’t expect anything greater than a neutral outcome.
Careful there, you are getting dangerously close to pre-crime justifications. I agree with you wholeheartedly. Unfortunately, drug distribution crimes are at the top on risk of re-offending (only bellow financial fraud and related economic crimes, mind you). Now, the other side of the coin is that most people who need mental health care the most, due to risk of violence or harm to self and others, are the ones less likely to willingly seek for it. Now, the US justice system sucks, and isn’t more than a slave making machine. However, in this particular case, the only way to ensure the person is not a danger towards others is to pass them through that faulty system. Because it is the only mechanism the system has at hand. I agree that more activism is necessary for a judicial system reform for humane treatment of convicts, and better access to social protections and mental health care opportunities outside of the system. However, that is the ideal world, this is the real world. And right now, just removing their license does nothing. Statistics tells us that he will just switch to be a life coach and keep distributing drugs to addicts, just illegally. Legality has never stopped anyone from doing something.
I doubt he’d make this kind of misstep again, jail or no.
It was not a misstep. He gave ketamine to Perry in the first place in order to get him hooked on it while counseling about his addiction with other drugs. He is not a poor repentant fellow who made a honest mistake. He is a corrupt health staff member that, without the proper behavior correctional support, would probably do it again if given the chance.
I wouldn’t call the American prison system correctional support
Neither would I, hence the qualifiers. Doesn’t change the argument though.
Perry killed himself
What the fuck. The ketamine didnt even kill him (which would be almost impossible), he fucking drowned. You would need to inject like a litre of ketamine infusion for a lethal dose.
“A medical examiner’s report found that Perry died from the acute effects of ketamine, a surgical anesthetic, and drowning was a secondary cause.”
I know you’re getting disliked, but I feel like I have to agree with you. How the fuck is drowning a secondary cause of death? The Ketamine definitely could have K-holed him and made him drown, which I guess you could say the Ketamine killed him in that way, but in reality, it seems silly to say anything other than he just drowned.
If somebody is drunk driving and crashes and kills themself, I don’t think we’d report alcohol toxicity as the primary cause of death.
Not to be unnecessarily mean to the dead guy, but you have to be pretty stupid to do a large amount of a drug that is very well known to make you pretty much unconscious while in a body of water.
Well said
And yet in your example we could easily cite and convict the bartender who kept serving him.
Thanks for proving the point masterfully.
He didn’t die because of the coma, he died of starvation! Because he couldn’t eat, because he was in a coma.
Same when you have AIDS, you don’t die of AIDS, you die of the smaller infections that would never have killed you if you didn’t have AIDS in the first place, we all know it’s AIDS that killed you. Doctors aren’t dumb, they know that the cause is the drug that put him in the state that caused him to drown. He wouldn’t have drowned without the drug. That’s why drowning is a secondary cause, the drug is still the first. Like when you get drunk and pass out in a puddle and drown, the cause of death is alcohol, by means of drowning.
If somebody is drunk driving and crashes and kills themself, I don’t think we’d report alcohol toxicity as the primary cause of death.
It is literally drunk driving. Well, crashing while under the influence.
Not to be unnecessarily mean to the dead guy, but you have to be pretty stupid to do a large amount of a drug that is very well known to make you pretty much unconscious while in a body of water.
I see you have no concept of addiction.
You only need a few grams to be lethal(normal dose is a couple hundred milligrams) and that’s if you’re not drinking alcohol. Alcohol is a bad idea to mix.
Ketamine and alcohol can make you nauseous but unable to control your body so you asphyxiate in your own vomit.
Afaik LD50 of ketamine is estimated at around 100 times the amount of a recreational dose, so around 100x100mg=10g. Sure, you could just eat it, but you would need way more than that, because the bioavailability of ingested Ketamine is much lower.
Smorting 10g of ketamine is literally impossible because your nose would clog up after max. 1g and you wouldnt be able to lift a finger for the next few hours.
But what were actually talking about here is injected ketamine (not sure if he used IV or IM, but it should be similar), which would need to be dissolved in water. You cant dissolve 10g of ketamine in 10ml of water. What I was talking about is the regular medical IM/IV solution (which Perry probbaly used), which usually is 50mg/ml. For 10g of ketamine, that would be 10g/(50mg/ml) = 10.000g/(50mg/ml) = 200ml. So maybe not impossible, but it would take 20+ normal syringes. There are higher concentrattion solutions, for which it is recommended to dilute them first for medical use, but for the sake of the argument you could probably inject 40ml of 250mg/ml solution and OD from that.
But just to be clear, in Perrys case they tested his blood and the ketamine concentration was around a “regular” recreational dose.I just did some brief research and the LD50 for intravenous ketamine is way lower than that. I’ve seen a lot of different numbers but anywhere from 50 to 150 milligrams per kilogram. Oral LD50s are much higher in the range you’re talking about.
Well 50-150mg/kg would be 4-12g for an 80kg adult. I dont think 10g is such a bad estimate. Ofc we cant know for sure because there are probably only a handful of ketamine deaths in humans. Estimates usually come from tests with rats or mice.
Oral being higher is kind of what I was saying with the lower bioavailability.
