Can we get a consensus on whether our community should de-federate with servers that host loli? I personally think we should block them, and if that ends up not being the consensus here then I’ll probably sign up on another server. I hope we can all agree to set that boundary though because I like it here and it seems otherwise pretty cool.
Please do not. Although I don’t personally want to see lolicon stuff, many of the servers willing to host it have communities I want to interact with. For instance, burggit.moe is where the touhou communities went and is otherwise a pretty nice instance aside from loli communities.
It is content which, while understandably offensive to some, harms nobody. All fictional porn, no matter how deviant it is, is ultimately more ethical than real porn can be.
It should be up to users to block or hide instances with content they don’t wish to see, and defederation should be reserved for communities that consistently cause interference, not for communities that simply have content which one disagrees with.
This
Yeah its a pretty nice experience on burggit other than the one or two loli communitys (that everyone can easily block for themselves)
why are all of the touhou communites on there
like, that’s weird; there’s tons of lemmy instances that they could have been on, and kbin has a (very inactive) community as well
onto the point:
All fictional porn, no matter how deviant it is, is ultimately more ethical than real porn can be.
This may be true, but you can’t blame many users for being really turned off by it; like I think it’d be perfectly acceptable if most people don’t want to interact with an instance hosting that.
If you don’t like that, then you might have to move to another instance tbh
As I’ve pointed out in a few spots on this post: regardless of your moral stance, loli is considered the same as child porn by many government agencies. You may not be “harming” anyone, but you’re harming the people that host and view that content in a criminal sense.
You got downvoted for telling the truth. This place is the new reddit.
deleted by creator
It should be up to instance admins to decide, since they are ultimately responsible for the things that are hosted/accessible on their server.
I for one would not want to be effectively distributing any porn or loli stuff on my server, so I’ll be defederating from instances that are entirely that.
Loli stuff is illegal though, at least in the United States. Viewing even accidentally can be considered a crime. The OP has a valid point.
deleted by creator
I’m not a lawyer either, but a quick search shows that state law is the thing this could be breaking. It’s not criminally punishable to possess it, but acquiring or distributing it via the internet is potentially illegal. Here’s a page from a Massachusetts lawyer discussing the legality. https://anthonyricciolaw.com/is-lolicon-legal-in-the-us/#:~:text=Under federal law%2C a simple,state laws regarding child pornography.
Edit: apparently that’s only part of the requirements for illegality. The other part is sexuality or not having “value” which is subjective. Either way, it’s a dice roll on criminal acts.
deleted by creator
I’ve seen this image where it’s basically a state by state case of legality
deleted by creator
This server isn’t in the United States.
Why not just leave it up to users on user by user basis? Are we already trying to regulate stuff on this platform? Block stuff if you don’t like it, ignore if not. I’m by no means for loli personally, but that’s going to start a snowball of overstepping and pretty soon it’ll be like R where everything is locked, deleted, blocked, or hidden.
If it’s not illegal, ignore it.
The “slippery slope” argument is a logical fallacy.
Disregarding an argument because it contains a fallacy is a fallacy too.
We’ve seen this happen on Reddit and I’ve seen it happen in multiple subs. The comment might have been alarmist but given past examples it’s not unfounded.
Tu quoque is a fallacy. Pointing out fallacies isn’t, I checked.
I cant say that defederating is the right or wrong move, I’m just tired of bad faith argument. There is a balance to be stricken between regulation and libertarianism, the question to be answered is where that balance lies. Disavowing any new regulation as an inevitable descent into complete loss of freedom is ridiculous.
Not appearing on a list with a Latin name doesn’t mean something isn’t a fallacy either. They’re inventing all sorts of new and exciting ways to be wrong lately.
I don’t disagree with your stance. I just want to point out that the fallacy exists. It’s called the “Fallacy fallacy” or “Argument from fallacy”
Well shit, I stand corrected. Props to you. /gen
Loli is illegal in some countries. It’s illegal in the US, if that’s where OP is located. Any depiction of a minor in a sexual situation, whether drawn or photographed, is considered child pornography.
it isn’t illegal in the us another comment thread was discussing it
Users can block whole communities just like blocking individuals, I hope people will consider doing that before advocating complete defederation if possible.
Disclosure, sh.itjust.works isn’t my home server but we’re obviously federated.
What about blocking the entire instance?
I just block the communities out of my home feed
Pretty sure right now you would need to make your own server to do that since it’s on a server level.
How do you block an entire instance? I’ve only seen how to block users and communities.
It’s something the admins do, check sh.itjust.works/instances for a list of the ones they’ve blocked already.
Isn’t that the point of decentralization allowing users to pick and choose what they want to see? If you don’t want to see Loli all you have to do is block the server from your feed. I’m not a fan of Hentaiof any of its subs. But I digress, I’m not on your server so I guess I don’t really have a say. 😁
I don’t want to see gore to block it, though.
No the point of decentralization is not that the user has to do all the moderation work themselves.
No need to defederate. I just went and blocked loli and related communities that popped up. I will never see them again.
So, my vote is NAY.
Federation is still young.
It may be easy to individually block communities now but what about in a few months/years when there are potentially 10x more communities across 10x more instances?
How intimidating would it be for a new user to have to go through 100+ communities and block them all individually instead of just blocking 5-10 instances?
Would you say the same about a gore community?
I would block gore communities on a personal level, but there’s no need to do so on a server level unless they’re doing something worth defederating for, like any of the following:
- posting cp
- using their server to DoS/DDoS others
- dox-ing people
- allowing their users to harass others AND refusing to punish such behavior
- same as above except for ban evasion
I’d like to have a force-nsfw option for communities that don’t enforce proper usage of the NSFW tag, but for now I’d have to block them most likely.
I like watching gore.
I don’t like gore, but I miss /r/watchpeopledie. I learned a lot from that.
Then you’re more than welcome to; I’m just not a fan.
Personally, I’m fine with a NSFW tag, and would hope that NSFW instances respect other instances enough to properly tag stuff.
Any instance with a gore community? Nah, screw that noise. Add it to the block list.
Tbh I think an instance not enforcing tagging content as nsfw is probably very strong grounds for blocking imo
Absolutely.
But that’s such a bad user experience.
I mean I should hope it’d be blurred out on All
with a content warning or without? Blurring is useful for lewd content imo where you don’t suffer when clicking it, it just hides for the public when reading in train. But I don’t want content just blurred that is literally mentally scarring to the average user.
A NSFL tag would do fine.
How exactly do I do that?
You click the three dots at the bottom-right corner of a post/comment and then click 🚫 to block the community/poster.
Just block the communitys you don’t want to see.
For the sake of argument I’ll approach this from a different perspective than everyone else.
Depending on jurisdiction there might be implications in hosting an instance that is federated with instances that host loli. I’m not familiar enough with Canada’s laws and / or le Code Civil du Québec to know if it is considered CSAM, but assuming it is does federating with those communities replicate the media on this instance as well? Would this count as ‘redistributing it’?
Canada laws on CSAM are very strict. even written fictional text are considered csam by law definition. And yes, a known horror novel writer has been charged for csam production in a fiction book. he’s been acquitted tho, fortunately. But that raise an alarm that tell us that cops can arrest you for pretty much anything . If you sculpt a loli into ficello string cheese , that enter the definition of CP in Canada.
there is a part of definition saying: "and other visual representation " which is very vague and broad .
https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/c-46/section-163.1.html
deleted by creator
I am biased in this situation, but I just think leaving it to the individual to block specific communities is better than blocking an entire instance for every user.
Yeah blocking a whole instance because they allow something like that is definitely way over the top of a reaction.
Yeah, full agree. So far I’ve only had to block a few communities to get the loli to stop popping up on all, but a rogue instance could really start to spam people with pretty horrible stuff. That’s what defederation is for, it seems, but there needs to be some rules in place for when the instance ban-hammer gets called upon.
It would be very nice if clients like Jerboa allowed users to choose to ban/filter specific instances for themselves without affecting everyone else, though.
I’d also like to have the ability to block entire instances. Not sure if the architecture would allow that, but at least the mobile apps should be able to filter out all posts from a specific instance
I think as a user you can block a particular instance from showing up in your feed (for just you obviously).
You can’t block instances, as a user. There’s an issue for it opened on Lemmy’s git repo though. You can block communities, though that gets more tedious as more communities pop up.
Im afraid to ask, but what is loli? Definitely don’t feel like looking it up if people are that put off by it.
Hentai of underage persons. A lot of the time they’ll try to pretend it’s not by dressing it in a fantasy or scifi setting but that’s what it essentially is. I personally see it as cp
Thank you, definitely glad I didn’t look that one up.
So pedo cartoons?
Child porn but with drawing
Depending where you live, it can be “still be legal” because no kid were raped, or illegal. So I am 100% sure blocking the whole instance hosting child-porn. I don’t want to get in trouble with the law for watching the front-page. More important, I don’t want hear that lemmy is used by pedophile to exchange child-porn
deleted by creator
needs to be at least easy to make sure default all is sane, once a user signs in and does what they will they can see or block what they please, with start being the same sfw default .
