If this backlash kills off tipping in America forever, good.
Employers should be paying their employee a living wage anyways, instead of shifting the responsibility to the customers.
In states that don’t still need to pay minimum wage, I get your point. The last two states that I’ve lived in, though, still require min wage (or higher, depending on some municipalities).
Restaurants operate on notoriously small margins and are tough to make it as a mom and pop, a lot of the time.
I’d rather tip, and have the assurance that money is going to the worker, than pay $30 for a burger and be told the employee is getting a cut.
If they can’t survive because they have to pay their employees their business model is unsustainable.
Except at some restaurants that money isn’t going to the employee, but to the employees* front/back of house… So you’re still only being told the employee is getting a cut… And the bigger company can still outdo mom and pop by volume.
Where I live, there are plenty of restaurants with tipflation.
And then there are the worker-owned pizza joint and coffee shop, which do not even have a tip jar on the counter. They don’t ask for — or make room for — tips. They pay their worker-owners well enough that they don’t have to beg.
That’s what tipping culture is. It’s putting the worker in the position of begging from the customer instead of being assured a fair wage by the employer. And now, the management even wants to tax the receipts of this mandatory panhandling.
Now, I understand that authoritarians love this. When I was a kid, I was explicitly told that tips were necessary; otherwise the waiter might spit in your food. That is, as a child of the professional class, I was instructed that service workers must be appeased with donations to keep them from committing crimes against us.
Yeah. That’s pretty messed up.
But the worker-owned venues make it clear: the restaurant doesn’t need tips to attract capable & honest workers; they just need to give a fair deal.
Another solution is profit sharing programs. E.g. an employee gets wage+(net income/all workers hours)*hours worked or a similar but fair formula or set of formulas.
Yet another thing that has been eye opening about living in Europe is how fucked and terrible tipping is in the states. Twenty percent AS A MINIMUM? When I’m picking up food at the counter??? AYFKM?
If a business can’t afford to pay its workers a living wage that business should not exist. If we all stopped going to these places they’ll be forced to fix it.
But Reddit Vs Lemmy is like a microcosm of this issue. Most people will stay on Reddit because god forbid they get inconvenienced or have to do something differently.
The same way people won’t leave twitter, won’t stop getting food at McDonalds or shopping at Wal-Mart, etc…
Not to mention, you can’t have a percentage go up and blame it on inflation.
I’m American but lived in Japan for a couple of years. I was so shocked by the amazing customer service the Japanese workers gave me but never asked or expected a tip.
I was so confused coming back here and seeing all of stores implementing an option to tip and I’m trying to figure out… for what? Most of the workers hardly acknowledge me when I’m there and it feels as if I’m bothering them coming to order something, and then they turn the iPad around asking for a tip.
This honestly needs to stop.
I was so shocked by the amazing customer service the Japanese workers gave me but never asked or expected a tip.
That’s how the entire world works outside of NA.
I always say it’s shocking what us Americans are accustomed to here in the US, and those that have never been outside of the country would never know these things. I also visited Australia for a bit and noticed no one asked or expected a tip as well.
Glad I had the opportunity to see how other countries do things outside the US 🙂
It’s becoming a bit more like that with service charges automatically added to bills in the UK, but only for restaurant meal, never for anything else.
I once asked to have an automatic tip removed from my order at the cheese bar in Camden and they seemed ready to bite my nose off. Supposed to be a place that knows a bit about labour history, Camden. Not going back, the food was late and it all came at different times.
As a terrible seppo immigrant I feel like I’m being chased by the terrible seppo shit I ran away from, sometimes.
And yet there’s this myth that without tips all the workers would be lazy and you’d get no good service.
I’ve heard and seen that repeated constantly.
I think thats more to do with Japanese culture than anything. Staff at even convenience stores were super nice and helpful when I stayed in Japan. But here people don’t really care that much. You cant expect a culture of people to change. Id much rather permanently live in Japan if my work and family didnt tie me down.
I don’t support tipping culture.
It always amazes me that that tipping is still a thing. If your business can’t survive paying a proper wage to your employees without the need for supplemental income from the customer your business isn’t meant to survive. Isn’t that the capitalism they’re always on about?
They are TRYING their best at making it a thing in other countries as well. Companies that are saying no to free money at no effort is rare.
its our duty to stop it when we see it. I don’t care how much it makes me look like a grumpy old prick, if I’m.asked or prompted for a tip in Australia they will get a No. don’t get me started on the lack of actual service post-covid where the only interaction you have with someone is when they physically bring stuff to your table
“capitalism”, hah
If I know owners of a particular restaurant don’t take care of their employees or treat them badly, then I probably won’t want to eat there anyways.
My girlfriend and I went to a retail store one time and at checkout the cashier turned the iPad around and showed us a tip screen……
We need a competition for “most ridiculous place to ask for tips”.
Someone in this thread said that their self-checkout asked for a tip. I don’t know how one could top that!
Airport grab’n’go kiosk, I thought I saw. For that extra spicy fuck you.
One time at the Starbucks drive thru, waiting several minutes for a cold brew, only a cold brew, I was irritated to see a very obvious tip cup on the drive through. After waiting much longer than it should have taken to pour a cold brew, the guy tried to solicit a tip on my card… seriously…It is absolutely irritating to have them not only provide slow service but then aggressively demand a tip for shitty service. I’ll tip when it’s appropriate, bartenders, waiters (20+%) and straight food delivery (fuck Uber eats, door dash etc, I won’t pay 50.00 for 30.00 in food and then tip, that’s stupid, so I don’t use it.)
Edit(I don’t use the food delivery services, I am not going to stiff their folks delivering food. )
I’m curious how many of these POS (Point-of-Sale, not Piece of Shit) systems have the default settings to ask for tips. If so, I wonder how many of these places are committing wage theft by not actually paying tips out to the employees.
Given their reliability, both are accurate.
The other day I went to a pub, and the machine at checkout suggested a 10%. You mean you expect me to tip 10% to this person whose contribution to my life was literally just putting my glass to a tap, pulling on the lever, then putting the price into the machine??
How about instead you just pay the person a proper wage to do that alongside all the other non-customer facing stuff they already have to do instead of making us top-up their wages.
Tipping culture was meant to be a bonus for exceptional service, not an expectation for all bloody services!
I’ll tip for sit down service or delivery… Anything else you can fuck right off.
My general guide for tipping
- traditional service industry where their employer pays them $2/hr. YES, but I wish your employer would just pay you. I’m still tipping not going to punish their employer for that but seriously try not to even go to these places anymore.
- Other traditional services industries, barbor, nail salon,etc. Yes as appreciation. They personally took care of me so yeah.
- Baristas, it any other ipad station. NO. They are paid a standard wage. I might drop my change in a tip jar every now and then when paying cash but that’s it.
- Food trucks and other independently owned stores. Generally No. Food trucks are independently owned and not service industry. If they need more money charge more for the food.
charge more for the food
Yes! Just do this! I promise you seeing more expensive prices on the menu will annoy me FAR less than getting the check and seeing a surprise 18% “service fee.”
Or having your food taste more horsey than normal.
Even for point 1 it’s just wrong. They should not work there for that wage and if the business needs to charge more money to pay them more then charge more money.
Relying on tips for worker pay not only shifts the responsibility for paying the employees away from employer to the customer but also makes employees getting paid optional (depending on how a random person that walked in feels).
I always ask the person helping me if they actually get the tip money when using some kind of kiosk. A ridiculous number of places “tip out” not only to cooks, but to managers and owners.
If I have cash and I think they deserve a tip, I will give them the cash directly and tell them to pocket it.
I just wish jobs payed livable wages.
shoutout to !workreform@lemmy.world, or /c/workreform@lemmy.world
I had no idea until recently that coffee shops are allowed to pay tipped wages instead of regular minimum wage. Right now, I am reading up on my state (Florida)‘s minimum wage laws, and apparently any employee who receives tips can be considered a tipped employee, meaning if your workplace has a square POS, congrats, they are allowed to pay you $5.44/hr! The tip credit explanation is also absolutely blowing my mind with a combination of confusion and corporate greed. The fact that there is an under-20 minimum wage of $4.25/hr is absolutely mind-boggling. I could MAYBE understand this for people under 18, but people from 18-20 are adults and plenty of them have already moved out of their parents’ homes. How is this okay?!?
In some places it’s $2.13/hr. It’s not ok. It’s never been ok. We need to change.
Which leads to a more ridiculous expectation that customers should know local labor laws, and then start asking employees about their wages to determine if we should tip them or not. Its really frustrating, and I just wish people paid for labor instead of playing on our emotions.
Not going to happen as long as tipping culture persists.
If patrons stopped tipping, and restaurant staff stopped working until a living wage is paid to them, what options do restaurant owners have? They’ll have to accommodate or close their doors.
Either way is better for everyone, since a business that can’t pay their employees isn’t a viable business anyway.
I tried to do grocery shopping at instacart recently.
The prices looked good, I spent some time making a bigger basket(around 100$) and went to checkout. Then I found out that they charge service fee about 13$, delivery fee 4.50$, heavy fee and at the very end they also added tax. My 100$ shopping was now over 120$ but then they asked me to tip the driver and options were 10% or 20%. I tried to enter custom amount but was discouraged with a scary prompt saying that my driver will see the tip and that tips under 15% are highly discouraged as my order might be deprioritised… so all those service fees, delivery fees and heavy fees are just used to run the website?! But actually paying your own employees? Nooo… that’s up to you, kind stranger on the internet! Please, be generous (we are tired to look for another poor bastard every two weeks or so)!
I don’t really think it’s caused backlash in me - just the ending of feeling bad for not tipping. Do I want to tip for you handing me something? Do I want to tip for self checkout? Do I want to tip for you checking me out?
You make a normal wage and haven’t done anything outside of the norm. Why on earth do you deserve a tip?
Pretty soon there’s going to be tip options on the self checkouts.
Removed by mod
Is it a discount?
I say it absolutely crushed that it’s sarcasm and not some weird twilight level craziness.
a
