I’m an old guy. I think there are a few things that influenced this. For one, there’s a basic kernel of truth in that we tend to be more naive when we’re younger because we lack experience. We’re unrealistic about what’s feasible. Lots of folks also get a bit more jaded as they get older because it’s hard to see the same bad shit over and over and react to it the same way the 100th time as you did the first time. Throw in that folks were generally less politically polarized for the older generations. Conservative vs liberal, for average people, tended to be more about how much money we spend on defense and how much on social programs.
So a lot of people moving through that landscape did feel that some of their liberalism came from unrealistic idealism. But things are different now. We’re so polarized, and the wedge issues are so fundamental to peoples’ lives. I know, I was personally raised in a relatively conservative household, and I’ve grown more and more into a flaming liberal because I see conservatism as an assault on personal freedoms and on science.
It used to be a conservation over the coffee table about the merits of taxing less and providing less, versus taxing more and providing more. Now it’s devolved into identity politics and whatever the latest culture war is with opposite side vehemently against whatever culture war of the day is. Conversations rarely get past that point, and I think this has all been done by design.
Yeah, I honestly think it goes back to when Republicans decided to specifically court evangelical Christians. As part of that, they painted liberals as not just wrong, but evil. You can negotiate and compromise with someone you think is wrong, but not someone you think is evil. That was the beginning of our politics becoming excessively polarized, in my opinion.
Yes, that’s true. It was both the biggest blunder and most optimal strategy that they ever played. It worked out “tremendously” to quote a former president’s favorite words, in the short term. But now their monster is coming out alive. No one expected them to win seats, it was astroturfing afterall… but now here we are.
Well, it worked tremendously for decades. They got middle America and the south to vote for conservative politicians to stop liberals from murdering babies and implementing communism or socialism. Meanwhile, those politicians voted in tax cuts for the rich and reduced corporate oversight, which was the real goal. Wonder why average worker salaries have gone up around 14% since the late 70s whole CEO salaries have gone up 1200% in the same period? It goes back to this.
Then you have actors like Russia who correctly identify it as a weak spot, and therefore dump as much fuel on the fire as they can.
And profiteers like the church, who keep their cash-cows enraged and engaged by building big blue strawmen.
It’s not any kind of coordinated effort, just the end result of lots of different flavors of bullshit thrown in the same pile… but there are definitely people who benefit from it.
And it feels disingenuous to even mention that it can go both ways, but look at things like presidential elections and how many vote not for a candidate based on their merits, but against the other bastard based on how horrible they are.
Christians have been a major driving force for this, namely evangelicals.
A lot of people will say it’s the nature of a 2 party system or some shit, but it’s really the natural conclusion to a society that’s driven by religion.
As far as I know, the modern ideology really started in the 70’s with the Jesus freaks movement, but the general attitude has been around forever (look at the Pentecostals and other big tent denominations as far back as the 1800’s and their constant war on secularism). But this batch of Christians have been systematically working toward taking over positions of power and even trying to out-produce everyone else in order to raise little versions of themselves (look up ‘The Joshua Generation’) with the ultimate purpose of simply outnumbering everyone else. There’s been an intentional and calculated plan that I’ve known of my whole life because we were literally and directly talking about it regularly in church.
Then evangelicalism went mainstream and became the loudest group of religious zealots in the country and everyone just sat back and said next to nothing while they started the satanic panic and the likes of Limbaugh latched on for powers sake and fomented the fear and anger on the right in a way that the left just never even tried to do. And for the last 40 years this cohort has grown and grown until we have what we have now.
The 2 party system isn’t the reason, it’s the tool.
I’m an old guy. I think there are a few things that influenced this. For one, there’s a basic kernel of truth in that we tend to be more naive when we’re younger because we lack experience. We’re unrealistic about what’s feasible. Lots of folks also get a bit more jaded as they get older because it’s hard to see the same bad shit over and over and react to it the same way the 100th time as you did the first time. Throw in that folks were generally less politically polarized for the older generations. Conservative vs liberal, for average people, tended to be more about how much money we spend on defense and how much on social programs.
So a lot of people moving through that landscape did feel that some of their liberalism came from unrealistic idealism. But things are different now. We’re so polarized, and the wedge issues are so fundamental to peoples’ lives. I know, I was personally raised in a relatively conservative household, and I’ve grown more and more into a flaming liberal because I see conservatism as an assault on personal freedoms and on science.
It used to be a conservation over the coffee table about the merits of taxing less and providing less, versus taxing more and providing more. Now it’s devolved into identity politics and whatever the latest culture war is with opposite side vehemently against whatever culture war of the day is. Conversations rarely get past that point, and I think this has all been done by design.
Yeah, I honestly think it goes back to when Republicans decided to specifically court evangelical Christians. As part of that, they painted liberals as not just wrong, but evil. You can negotiate and compromise with someone you think is wrong, but not someone you think is evil. That was the beginning of our politics becoming excessively polarized, in my opinion.
Yes, that’s true. It was both the biggest blunder and most optimal strategy that they ever played. It worked out “tremendously” to quote a former president’s favorite words, in the short term. But now their monster is coming out alive. No one expected them to win seats, it was astroturfing afterall… but now here we are.
Well, it worked tremendously for decades. They got middle America and the south to vote for conservative politicians to stop liberals from murdering babies and implementing communism or socialism. Meanwhile, those politicians voted in tax cuts for the rich and reduced corporate oversight, which was the real goal. Wonder why average worker salaries have gone up around 14% since the late 70s whole CEO salaries have gone up 1200% in the same period? It goes back to this.
Who designed it and why? I don’t think there’s actually anyone who benefits from this shit.
It’s a product of the two party system and FPTP.
Then you have actors like Russia who correctly identify it as a weak spot, and therefore dump as much fuel on the fire as they can.
And profiteers like the church, who keep their cash-cows enraged and engaged by building big blue strawmen.
It’s not any kind of coordinated effort, just the end result of lots of different flavors of bullshit thrown in the same pile… but there are definitely people who benefit from it.
And it feels disingenuous to even mention that it can go both ways, but look at things like presidential elections and how many vote not for a candidate based on their merits, but against the other bastard based on how horrible they are.
Christians have been a major driving force for this, namely evangelicals.
A lot of people will say it’s the nature of a 2 party system or some shit, but it’s really the natural conclusion to a society that’s driven by religion.
As far as I know, the modern ideology really started in the 70’s with the Jesus freaks movement, but the general attitude has been around forever (look at the Pentecostals and other big tent denominations as far back as the 1800’s and their constant war on secularism). But this batch of Christians have been systematically working toward taking over positions of power and even trying to out-produce everyone else in order to raise little versions of themselves (look up ‘The Joshua Generation’) with the ultimate purpose of simply outnumbering everyone else. There’s been an intentional and calculated plan that I’ve known of my whole life because we were literally and directly talking about it regularly in church.
Then evangelicalism went mainstream and became the loudest group of religious zealots in the country and everyone just sat back and said next to nothing while they started the satanic panic and the likes of Limbaugh latched on for powers sake and fomented the fear and anger on the right in a way that the left just never even tried to do. And for the last 40 years this cohort has grown and grown until we have what we have now.
The 2 party system isn’t the reason, it’s the tool.