Israel has murdered at least 33,000 Palestinians, over 2/3 being civilians by their own count.
Collateral damage is not murder, nor are successful attacks against Hamas militants.
It’s interesting you cite that figure as evidence of Israel’s recklessness when it’s actually an astonishing accomplishment that they got the civilian casualty ratio so low, especially considering Hamas hides among civilians in densely populated areas. The commonly cited average in modern war is ~90% civilian casualties. This seems to be evidence that the great lengths they go to to reduce civilian casualties are paying off, not evidence they are being reckless when it comes to civilians. You’d never know it from the protesters, or comments like yours though.
Hamas has not surrendered nor have they been deposed. That’s when attacks would stop being self-defense.
Are you honestly ignoring the statistical evidence I provided that clearly shows it is? Were this war being waged by any other nation in the world you could expect the civilian casualties to be much higher.
A google search for this 20-1 claim yields no results. Credible citation?
If they did far better than their maximum acceptable casualties, and better than the average casualties under such conditions, isn’t that a good thing that should be celebrated?
Genocide, the crime, is a claim of intent and not casualty numbers. Israel says they intend to destroy Hamas, which is not a protected group under genocide statutes. Hamas says they intend to destroy Jews/Israel/Israelis, which are protected groups under genocide statutes. There is only one explicitly genocidal party in this conflict, and it’s not Israel. I support them because I oppose the genocidal.
Fuck you.
Childish insults? It’s sad you can’t respectfully disagree and support your position like an adult.
Then they are lying. I encourage you to watch the Oct 7 attack footage, (Content warning: violence, cruelty, death,) if you have the stomach for it, which clearly disproves any such claims. This is not collateral damage. They target civilians. Full stop.
Please do explain how murdering thousands of children is self-defense against Hamas. Were they strapping suicide vests to the babies and letting them crawl over to IDF troops?
Given my own experience and information, I find it a lot more appropriate to fight back against Hamas, the oppressive regime that instigated this war, hides among civilians to maximize casualties, and has refused to surrender to end the war, which they could do at any time. I believe they are the primary cause of all of this death and destruction and suffering, not Israel defending itself.
Would I feel the same way were I in their shoes? Hard to say.
You dodged the question. When the IDF is attacking and murdering Palestinians, do those Palestinians have a right to take up arms and fight back? It’s a simple yes or no question.
Some questions cannot be fairly answered with a simple yes or no, like, “Have you stopped beating your wife?”
There’s a lot of bias packed into your question. If the IDF is in fact MURDERING, as in, illegally killing people, yes they do. However, if the IDF is acting within the law they absolutely do not. Either way, I’d say it’s probably a bad move to do so and likely to get one shot.
I’m talking about right now. For example, for the people in Rafah. Do the Palestinians in Rafah have the right to fight back against the IDF that is shelling them and attacking their homes with tanks?
Can only be described as psychopathic response disguised as intellectual arguments. There aren’t enough dead babies, women and children that will move this person so long as they’re Palestinian.
Are you honestly defending the murder of over 22,000 Palestinian civilians since Oct 7, 2023 as being an Israeli achievement?
They just justified bombing schools full of children above as necessary for Israel’s self-defense, so I think that’s your answer.
I read through that and was surprised they didn’t call you an antisemite.
I would have pointed out that I’m a mod in c/Jewish, so that would have been fun.
Are you honestly ignoring the statistical evidence I provided that clearly shows it is? Were this war being waged by any other nation in the world you could expect the civilian casualties to be much higher.
If the murder of over 100 innocent civilians a day makes you cheer then I am done with this conversation.
You seem to have confused understanding with enthusiasm.
No, I have not.
Should I just start imagining your motivations and what makes you cheer and holding it against you? Is that how we roll here?
removed by mod
Childish insults? It’s sad you can’t respectfully disagree and support your position like an adult.
This is exactly how Hamas justifies October 7th…
Then they are lying. I encourage you to watch the Oct 7 attack footage, (Content warning: violence, cruelty, death,) if you have the stomach for it, which clearly disproves any such claims. This is not collateral damage. They target civilians. Full stop.
They’re the same concept to Hamas, and it seems that they’re the same concept to the IDF as well.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
Oct 7 attack footage,
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
Please do explain how murdering thousands of children is self-defense against Hamas. Were they strapping suicide vests to the babies and letting them crawl over to IDF troops?
Collateral damage still isn’t murder no matter how many times you repeat it, nor does hiding among children make Hamas immune from reprisal. Regarding women and children, their casualty figures were faked by Hamas and recently quietly revised by the UN.
Your outrage over child casualties is being manufactured and manipulated by Hamas.
Your “evidence” is a Reddit post.
Be better.
Citations and sources in the comments.
If you were honest, you would have linked to one of those sources, not a Reddit post.
If I’d done that, it would have been worthless. You need the additional context provided in that post.
You could have given that context yourself. Again, be better.
Question: Is it appropriate for those civilians to get weapons and fight back against the IDF that is killing them?
That’s a matter of opinion. I can understand why many Palestinians do find it appropriate, especially given the intense indoctrination that Palestinian children experience, and the lack of available unbiased credible information there.
Given my own experience and information, I find it a lot more appropriate to fight back against Hamas, the oppressive regime that instigated this war, hides among civilians to maximize casualties, and has refused to surrender to end the war, which they could do at any time. I believe they are the primary cause of all of this death and destruction and suffering, not Israel defending itself.
Would I feel the same way were I in their shoes? Hard to say.
You dodged the question. When the IDF is attacking and murdering Palestinians, do those Palestinians have a right to take up arms and fight back? It’s a simple yes or no question.
Some questions cannot be fairly answered with a simple yes or no, like, “Have you stopped beating your wife?”
There’s a lot of bias packed into your question. If the IDF is in fact MURDERING, as in, illegally killing people, yes they do. However, if the IDF is acting within the law they absolutely do not. Either way, I’d say it’s probably a bad move to do so and likely to get one shot.
I’m talking about right now. For example, for the people in Rafah. Do the Palestinians in Rafah have the right to fight back against the IDF that is shelling them and attacking their homes with tanks?
The real question is “are they people to you” and he’ll reply it’s not so simple
Of course they are people. Stop making me your strawman.
No, that’s a legal attack on Hamas. If they take up arms they are defending Hamas as a militant.
So, they just have to let themselves be blown up and shot and fighting back is illegal?
As if those are the only two options. Refugees in Rafah are evacuating, very few are being blown up or becoming militants.
Genocide apologist
Can only be described as psychopathic response disguised as intellectual arguments. There aren’t enough dead babies, women and children that will move this person so long as they’re Palestinian.